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Member postings for Andy Symons - BMFA

Here is a list of all the postings Andy Symons - BMFA has made in our forums. Click on a thread name to jump to the thread.

Thread: BMFA Achievement Scheme Roadshows
25/02/2017 19:42:34
Big thanks to those that came along to the first of the roadshows today. We hope you found it worthwhile.
There is another to be held in Royal Wooton Bassett on 18th March.
Thread: BMFA British National Championships Website
23/02/2017 13:45:00

Any information relatin g to any of the BMFA National Championships will be posted on the Nationals website at **LINK**

Thread: BMFA Achievement Scheme Roadshows
22/02/2017 21:13:23

A few places left for the Northern Achievement Scheme Roadshow this Saturday at Brighouse, West Yorkshire.

Lunch provided and a good chance to feedback your views on the achievement scheme.


Free to attend and open to all BMFA members with an interest in the scheme

Edited By Andy Symons - BMFA on 22/02/2017 21:14:18

Thread: Bmfa adds
16/02/2017 20:51:31
Never do a transaction where they arrange a courier to collect. Typical scamming trick.
It is also recommended you don't provide contact details and use the messaging system. If you provide contact details anyone in the world can contact you.
Thread: Are the BMFA Mandatory Questions Applicable?
12/02/2017 10:14:13
It certainly wont be the BMFA that suggests any tests are made compulsory. The BMFA does have a responsibility however to try and ensure members are fully aware of their legal responsibilities. Just based on countless social media posts and the number of sometimes quite experienced model aircraft flyers emails to the office there are many that arent aware of those responsiblities. It was previously possible that individuals could pass A and B tests without answering any questions on their legal responsibilities the only difference now is candidates definitely know they will have to answer 5 questions on the matter, questions they could have been asked previously anyway so certainly no requirement to learn anything new.
Just looking at the increased number of correct answers to the online quiz more are now better aware of those legal responsibilities. This small change to the tests has in no way come about because of drones but simply because too many were not aware of their responsibilities and anything that increases that awareness can only be a good thing.
The online quia has been completed over 7000 times btw.
11/02/2017 20:30:10
The guidance says.

It is expected that examiners will select questions that are appropriate to the test being
taken, however candidates should familiarise themselves with all of the questions on the list.
Candidates are not expected to be ?word perfect? with their answers but they should be able
to demonstrate that they are fully aware of the legal controls for model aircraft flying. For
example if a candidate gives the answer to Question 4 (What does article 241 of the ANO
state?) when asked Question 3 (What does article 240 of the ANO state?) it is likely they are
aware of both answers and the examiner should point out they have answered the wrong
question and ask for the correct answer.

Nobody is expected to recite the answers parrot fashion. John Stones post from earlier is what is expected.
11/02/2017 16:29:12
Hi Martin.

Your understanding is spot on. Excellent post.

I fail to see how reading your post, the main thrust of which is demonstrably incorrect, and then taking the time to correct you can be considered not listening.
11/02/2017 12:38:50

Well I hope, whatever anyone feels about the mandatory questions and how they are structured, that everyone can now agree that article 240 does apply to model aircraft flyers.

However there are a couple of opportunities coming up for any BMFA member with an interest in the scheme or who would like to express their opinions to members of the Achievement scheme review committee directly. Also chance to discuss anything at all about the scheme including the way forward.

Free to attend and lunch is provided. A great chance to meet others interested in the scheme. You do not have to be an instructor or examiner, just have an interest in providing constructive feedback.

Dates are 25th February in Brighouse, West Yorkshire. See **LINK**


18th March at Wooton Bassett. See **LINK**

There is an online booking form on the linked pages, why not a few together from your clubs and share travelling costs.

Still places available at both venues.

08/02/2017 13:00:08
Posted by kc on 08/02/2017 12:42:13:

Andy, the A test is used as a test of competence to fly solo in many ( most? ) clubs. If its not a test of competence to fly solo what is it? Why bother passing a test just to get a bit of paper if it doesnt qualify you to do something?

This is where the BMFA could solve lots of the problems with the Government over drones -suggest to the Governmemnt/CAA that a law be passed that RC model pilots must pass the BMFA A Cert to fly solo and be insured. No A cert then must have an A cert instructor to fly. Simple and it's worked for clubs for decades.

What clubs and individuals (and the CAA for that matter who accept some of the tests as proof of competence for commercial operation) use the tests for is up to them, yes the A cert is at a suitable level for that, however the test is simply a basic test of piloting skills, safety awareness and the legal responsibilities around model aircraft flying.

Are you really suggesting the BMFA should push for the govt/CAA that an A cert should be compulsory? Not a popular suggestion I would imagine and certainly not something the BMFA has ever considered.

BTW it is slightly under 50% of clubs that ask for the A to fly unsupervised.

As for why bother to pass a test that qualifies you for nothing, simple really the sense of "achievement" being one reason but personally speaking the real benefit of the scheme is the focus it gives thouse that decide to practice and work towards passing the certificates and the improved flying skills, safety awareness and awareness of responsibilities that goes along with that.

Edited By Andy Symons - BMFA on 08/02/2017 13:01:18

08/02/2017 12:09:27

We will have to agree to disagree then.

08/02/2017 11:49:40
Posted by kc on 08/02/2017 11:41:04:

This is a test for competance to fly solo not a test for lawyers!

No it isn't. It is a test of a basic level of piloting skills, safety awareness and the legal responsibilities of flying a model aircraft. It is not and has never been a test of competence to fly solo.

08/02/2017 11:46:40
Posted by Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator on 08/02/2017 11:27:39:

2. They have chosen to excempt model flyers from artcile 240 - which used to apply to us.

No they havent, nobody is exempt from article 240, it applies to absolutely every single individual in the UK.

Certain articles relate to aircraft, others to persons, 240 relates to persons (model aircraft flyers are persons) there is nothing anywhere in the ANO that suggests model aircraft flyers as a group of persons are exempt from article 240, otherwise we would have clearance to endanger an aircraft with our models.


You appear to be confusing a model aircraft with a model aircraft flyer. 2 very different things.

Edited By Andy Symons - BMFA on 08/02/2017 11:47:21

Edited By Andy Symons - BMFA on 08/02/2017 11:50:02

08/02/2017 00:05:05
There isnt any oops there. 240 doesnt apply to model aircraft as such bowever it clearly applies to model aircraft pilots and indeed applies to any person.

Edited By Andy Symons - BMFA on 08/02/2017 00:05:37

Thread: Should you invite drone pilots to your field?
07/02/2017 14:09:41
Posted by john stones 1 on 07/02/2017 14:03:51:

Now Now...don't be tarring forums with a negative brush, you've more here speaking positively on the topic.



It was rather a sweeping statement I agree.

07/02/2017 13:56:55
Posted by Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator on 07/02/2017 08:52:26:

Always nice to see how welcoming, open and forward thinking our hobby is,.....not. sad


Actually in general I think it is open and forward thinking, certainly in my experience most individuals and clubs certainly are, there are of course a small number of exceptions, sadly however, it is the nature and curse of forums and other social media that the negatives get far more exposure than the positives which sadly can help to foster innacurate perceptions.

Back to the topic under discussion though, it is pleasing that my article has generated some discussion and hopefully I have been able to positively influence some perceptions.

I have an excellent response to my request for "Drone friendly" clubs and the register is growing with quite a number still to add.

You can see the work in progress at **LINK**

Thread: BMFA Nationals notice
03/02/2017 11:48:14


Edited By Andy Symons - BMFA on 03/02/2017 11:48:21

Thread: LMA v BMFA insurance
23/01/2017 21:07:43
Posted by LMA Dave on 22/01/2017 22:58:18:
Posted by PatMc on 22/01/2017 21:12:17:

Is LMA membership without their insurance available ?

If you are a BMFA member then no as that offer is not available to LMA members from the BMFA it is as simple as that.

The BMFA put forward that offer a couple of years ago, however it was rejected.

23/01/2017 12:34:32
Posted by Peter Christy on 23/01/2017 10:30:28:The area in which I now live has had no representation even for clubs for a number of years now. Surely, for an organisation that insists that the clubs are its members, dis-enfranchising a whole county is even worse than the dis-enfranchisement of country members!

Hi Peter

This is somewhat incorrect, a number of years ago there was a quite fractious dispute in the South West area which happened to be along Devon vs Cornwall lines, so at that time and with full agreement of clubs in the South West 2 "sub-areas" were formed, however the Devon area decided they didn't particularly want the area meeting system as such so pretty much dissolved the sub area committee, again a decision by the area clubs not the BMFA, the area was administered by the Hon Sec, Robin Sleight, recently deceased, but the new Hon Sec will be continuing in the role. The Devon area clubs were stillr epresented at council meetings however by the South West area delegate as before so it is completely incorrect to say they have had no representation, they have had the same representation as before.

It should be pointed out that when it was suggested the sub area return to having the more familiar area system they decided they would like to carry on as now. So to sum up the area clubs are represented and the system they are ciurrently working under is what the area clubs want.

22/01/2017 16:32:55
Posted by Graham Chadwick on 22/01/2017 14:25:54:

Just to clarify my own views,

I DO NOT object to the fair membership fee at the present level.

I do however object to the insurance fee being set at 3 times the price it actually costs the BMFA. Its not relevant you perceived value, its the real cost we are talking about. (charge the cost £11+ £5 administration fee ) Dose that sound fair to you?

I do think the annual cost to OUR club of the magazines is ridiculous in these days of the internet. (Don't be patronizing about older members, we are not all sat mumbling to ourselves listening to the home service).

I do think the National flying sight is a vanity project that will only be a money pit of no benefit the 99.9% of our membership .

And lastly I would like the BMFA to be like some of the other clubs I am a member of and work to benefit its members with the negotiation of group discount for the membership, AND THEN PASS THESE BACK TO US, NOT TREBEL AND THEN TELL US THIS IS OUR ONLY COMPULSORY SUPPLIER .

These are my views and I do not claim to speak for anyone else. I am allways very suspicious of those claiming to speak for others, or for me.

Edited By Graham Chadwick on 22/01/2017 14:29:14

Edited By Graham Chadwick on 22/01/2017 14:32:10

As a point of order the BMFA does not sell insurance, it's a members association which costs £33 for senior members, insurance is simply one of the many excellent benefits of being a member. The "ridiculous" cost of the magazine is about £4.40 per member in total for the 6 issues, getting rid of the magazine would then require many other items to be posted out so possiby no saving at all by getting rid, as an aside it is a huge tick in the "plus" column as far as the CAA is concerned that we have a regular publication that gets posted to all members.

Thread: BMFA Electric Indoor Masters, next weekend 14th&15th January
14/01/2017 21:14:30

Excellent first day today. The standard of flying is improving every year. its worth a trip to see

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