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APC tiny bite

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Andy G.13/12/2017 08:44:17
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340 forum posts
183 photos

I wouldn't recommend using a regular sized starter on such a small diesel engine, if you're slightly over compressed there's a very real risk of seriously damaging the motor!! Small 1/2A size starters are o.k. if you can find one otherwise it's a chicken stick or a thick glove.

Jon Harper - Laser Engines13/12/2017 09:27:16
3356 forum posts
142 photos

Below is the result of a Laser 180 kicking back as i tried to start it. The engine only fired once and made quite a mess of my 25mm dia starting stick. Im glad it wasnt my finger

starter stick

Bob Cotsford13/12/2017 11:32:30
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6928 forum posts
393 photos

I've found the broom handle chicken stick that I use much more comfortable with an old motorcycle handlebar grip pushed on. It also acts as a bit of shock absorber for the odd kick-backs! APC props out of the packet or even with the edge toned down will easily cut through a rubber chicken finger with a 1/8" wall.

Geoff Sleath13/12/2017 12:26:54
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2175 forum posts
148 photos

I always use a chicken stick on the odd occasion I fly with a liquid fuelled power source. It's a piece of dowel about the thickness of broom stale with a soft rubber handle I pushed on. It really is very effective and actually spins the engine quicker than you can with a finger because of the increased lever length - think of ancient spear throwers that use the same principle.

So not only safer but more effective.

Geoff

FlyinBrian13/12/2017 13:00:33
450 forum posts

This post should have come with a warning about blood and gore - it fair made me feel giddy.

In the first club I belonged to we had a young lad about 15 or so who got a nick from a prop while trying to start his little OS, he fainted right out, took a couple of minutes before he was back with us and had to sit down for a while afterwards although he fully recovered after about ten minutes.

Mike T13/12/2017 13:44:09
285 forum posts
22 photos

Jon - can you recommend a less vicious alternative to Laser engines? devil

I always de-flash APC (and other) props. You can do this without significantly blunting the TE. Done properly, it can be part of the balancing process. I'll gladly sacrifice a few 10ths of a percent blade efficiency for a balanced prop!

Engine Doctor13/12/2017 13:52:09
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1843 forum posts
4 photos

Cut fingers on a cold day and diesel fuel (ether)getting into cut stung like hell ! The good old days wink

 

Four strokes  inc Lasers start  easier if well primed and  bounced back against compression . Either a gently flip against compression with a chicken stick or a finger/thumb flip of the spinner and they are away . 

Edited By Engine Doctor on 13/12/2017 13:56:21

Mike T13/12/2017 13:55:08
285 forum posts
22 photos

At least with diesel, you were effectively self-medicating!

Jon Harper - Laser Engines13/12/2017 15:21:15
3356 forum posts
142 photos

I was using the bounce back trick on the 180 but i slipped off the blade and caught the other as it flicked over. The force of my hand in one direction and the prop in the other was enough to shatter my long suffering stick. Its been a couple of years since i broke my last one so thats goodness knows how many starts.

And Mike, it wasnt vicious, it was eager

Don Fry13/12/2017 17:09:10
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1937 forum posts
26 photos

OK, what the hell is this bounce back trick. Explain please.

cymaz13/12/2017 17:22:25
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7232 forum posts
962 photos

Just just for you Don filmangel

Tom Major13/12/2017 18:00:44
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94 forum posts
22 photos

Nice one, subbed.

Went out with that .10FP today. As a chicken stick I used some old file wooden handle. Spent few minutes on general messing about and enjoying myself straight after work and she finally spoke to me



By the time when engine fired up it was already raining quite considerably and my left hand was freezing due to glow fuel. It didn't stop me and once I refilled the tank (it quit in the vid as I've run out of fuel) I was back out and kept flicking and flicking and it would't fire. Took me a while to realise my glow stick is dead laugh, but the engine itself runs and just needs tiny adjustments :D


Still trying to warm up after long day of work outside and commute in heavy rain ....

Don Fry13/12/2017 19:43:39
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1937 forum posts
26 photos

Thank you Cymas. Josh is not terribly forthcoming on technique. So this is a wet engine, hit backwards.

Going past TDC, or just pushed against the compression, hard enough to get some compression heat in the combustion chamber. And where does the stick end up.

New tricks are great, but I bet Jon had a commune with nature moment when his stick bounced off the floor.

Jon Harper - Laser Engines13/12/2017 19:47:10
3356 forum posts
142 photos

Don, the video posted covers it quite well but in essence you just bounce the engine backwards against compression, it fires, and then runs the right way. It works really well on a 4 stroke as the first thing that happens after it fires is the exhaust valve opens and all the rubbish in the cylinder is spat out the exhaust. This leaves the way clear for a new charge of fuel and its off. I start all of my glow engines this way.

Tom, she sounds pretty lean but at least you got it going without loss of limb! Also for reference methanol is toxic and can be absorbed through the skin. The effect is cumulative so try not to get too covered in raw fuel.

Jon Harper - Laser Engines13/12/2017 19:48:24
3356 forum posts
142 photos
Posted by Don Fry on 13/12/2017 19:43:39:

New tricks are great, but I bet Jon had a commune with nature moment when his stick bounced off the floor.

I was fine after I spat the splinters out

Tom Major13/12/2017 20:17:10
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94 forum posts
22 photos
Posted by Jon Harper - Laser Engines on 13/12/2017 19:47:10:

Tom, she sounds pretty lean but at least you got it going without loss of limb! Also for reference methanol is toxic and can be absorbed through the skin. The effect is cumulative so try not to get too covered in raw fuel.


I thought so too and I think I found a reason as well. On top of running out of fuel, I found the feed line pushed against the tank, right in the corner. That will get sorted before next outing, hopefully tomorrow. I need this engine for a model I'm starting to build this weekend smiley.

And I should have added, I was wearing latex glove on my left hand smiley.

Mowerman14/12/2017 11:30:46
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1480 forum posts
103 photos

Once spent ages trying to start a PAW 15 with APC prop, as a precaution I was wearing leather gardening gloves, after some time and many attempts I felt as if my finger we getting wet then found the glove and finger badly cut. Used a chicken stick there after.

Nigel R14/12/2017 12:24:22
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746 forum posts
202 photos

"And where does the stick end up."

I used to twist the spinner backwards. Engine needs to be wet as mentioned, and cooperative. I could only get some motors to reliably start this way.

Got a bit lazy lately and resort to the starter almost every time now. The starter also ensures fingers are a long way from the action.

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