Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted May 20, 2013 Author Share Posted May 20, 2013 The epoxy has dried dead level and glass hard - excellent. I'm not putting the fuselage part of the magnetic catch in place yet as it will be easier to do the control linkages without it in the way. So, just a quick update,... Battery shelf is in - not glued in yet I need to feed the velcro straps through first. And the aileron servo is in place.... Next up is the rudder and elevator servos and the snakes to install. BEB Edited By Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator on 20/05/2013 21:35:28 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted May 23, 2013 Author Share Posted May 23, 2013 I've been a bit busy at work this week so progress is a bit spasmodic. Anyhow I've got the aileron linkage in place and adjusted and that seems to be working well. Next up was fitting the rudder and elevator servos. They're now in and fixed down, so the inside is started to look a bit less bare,... There's plenty of space for the Rx now either under the rudder/elevator pair or between the aileron torque rods - the Frsky TR4 is tiny! Now, time for an introduction, please meet,... "Bill and Ben the Tucano Men"! Two 1/10 Jet Pilots from JP. I must say they took their time getting here - they must have walked from a well known model store in Sussex. Anyway, they're here now and very welcome they are too. After having their pictures taken they had a really nice relaxing bath in some warm soapy water - to clean off any travel dust (read "mould release"!) and I'm just going to start painting them. I really enjoy pianting pilots - not that I'm any good at it - I just like doing it! BEB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Winks Posted May 23, 2013 Share Posted May 23, 2013 Nice Mate interesting to see the slight but not significant differences between your model and mine regarding the control layout gives me confidence that I'm not so rusty at this game as I thought I might be lol Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted May 24, 2013 Author Share Posted May 24, 2013 Thanks Phil. I think your Tucano looks gorgous - that 3-blader is wonderful and sets it off really well. Yes you and I have hit on similar ways of putting it together inside - once you don't need all that space Nigel designed for the nicads moving the servos into the main bay becomes possible of course. Well what progress today? - I've installed the snake outers. Here's a view from inside above,... And from underneath the tail,... Now this job should have taken 30mins tops - it actually took over two hours! I knew I had a set of Sullivan snakes in - I'd bought them years ago but never used them. I've spent all the time since tripping over them, moving them from one place to another etc. Of course today, can I find them, can I hell! An hour and a half I spent looking everywhere before I located them in the "safe place" I'd put them! Ah well, it was ever thus! I've installed the battery shelf. Fitted out with a velcro base and two straps its been glued into place. Here's a trial run of the battery in place - actually its weighing down the tray while the glue dries! With all this in place the CoG is about 10mm too far forward. But of course the elevator, rudder and control links aren't in yet. Nor is the underneath of the tail sheeted. Having said that there's no spinner or prop on it yet either! But it's looking like it won't be too far out one way or the other. Finally Bill and Bill have been to the quartermaster and are now all suited and booted ready for action. Wing fairings next,... but first hopefully some flying this weekend. BEB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Winks Posted May 25, 2013 Share Posted May 25, 2013 Thanks for your comments on my efforts BEB and I have to say you've done a much better job than me with those pilots Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted May 26, 2013 Author Share Posted May 26, 2013 Commitment time,...we have to glue the bottom sheeting on thus sealing up the fuselage - always a moment of concern for me, I keep thinking I'm going suddenly remember something that has to be done inside - just after I've glued everything in place! Here's the bottom sheeting glued and pinned,... Next the wing fairings. This is a fiddly job. I couldn't get the rear of the fairing nearly as flat as I wanted - but I'll settle for this and with a bit of scrap underneath I don't think it will look too bad - to a one eyed man, in the dark, at 100 yards, going passed at 50mph! This job is difficult enough - but trying to get them the same either side is even more fun! The fairings look much steeper in this photograph than they actually are! I mean they are too steep - but not by as much as it looks here - honest! Well we're getting close now. Last bits of filler here and there then the final smooth sanding coming up (which always takes much longer than you expect) and then its on to the covering. That's when the fun will start. I have the glass and the Poly-C so we'll see how that will go, I'm looking forward to trying it out. BEB Edited By Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator on 26/05/2013 17:20:27 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Winks Posted May 26, 2013 Share Posted May 26, 2013 covering with poly C is a lot easier than using GRP BEB even though its a similar process just make sure you "wet" the wood well before laying up the 1st cloth, a roller helps on large flat areas but is not essential. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted May 26, 2013 Author Share Posted May 26, 2013 Thanks Phil I'll try that. I'll seal the wood first as I believe some folks have had issues with warping using Poly-C. Then as you say I'll use a roller to lay down a base into which I can place the glass cloth. The instructions say the Poly-C dries in 20mins - so I can see the sense in using the roller! BTW - while I'm here! One of the Mods has expressed his surprise that I sheeted the bottom with the wood grain along the axes and not cross-wise. He's quite right of course - normally you would sheet the bottom with a series of cross grain squares getting smaller and smaller towards the tail. But - on the plans Nigel shows a servo hatch for the first 6" of so - grain lengthwise - then cross grian to the tail. I intended to do this (even though I don't need a hatch beciase my servos are accessable via the canopy) then I realised that as I had a nice straight piece of pretty hard balsa, and the fuselage is fairly narrow so II felt I could get away with leaving the grain lengthwise for the full run. Nigel specifies soft balsa for this part - but then he is very worried about the model coming out tail heavy because his servos are well back in the rear of the fuselage. My worry is the opposite, that this model is going to come out nose heavy! So I can afford the luxury of some heavier balsa back there. So, in short, I took advantage of the situation to cut a bit of a corner and just stick a long piece down the bottom! Seems plenty strong enough! BEB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted May 27, 2013 Author Share Posted May 27, 2013 I've been thinking about it overnight - those wing fairings have got to go! They're just not right and its offending me. I'll cut them off and have another go. BEB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted May 28, 2013 Author Share Posted May 28, 2013 Well, I have been looking at photographs of Tucanos - lots of them. Particularly any that show the point where the fairing meets the fuselage and very particularly at the trailing edge junction. And I have found something that has rather surprised me. My fairings may not be so far wrong afterall! There's a photo of the general fairing area,... It seems to show that at the trailing edge of the wing the fairing under surface is not perfectly flat to the undersurface of the wing - there is a slight upsweep. Here's a couple of shots in close up,... In the last one the fairing edge follows the edge of the dark grey area. There is a definite upward sweep. OK I know that technically this is an Embraer not a Shorts - and my model will be ZF446, a Shorts Tucano - but this sort of aspect will be the same on both I would guess. So, I've convinced myself to leave the fairings in place. True, mine have a bit more upward sweep than the prototype - but not that much. And with a bit of judiciously applied filler to blend them in they're starting to look quite acceptable. BEB PS All this justification has nothing what-so-ever to do with the fact that I have less than 4 weeks to finish and test fly this model. No, no. Nothing at all to do with that! Edited By Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator on 28/05/2013 12:17:13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martyn K Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 Hi BEB Yours still look bigger (pro rata scale) than the ones on the photo.. Sorry about that. Martyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Winks Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 Just leave them as is BEB claim they're a charctature feature Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiiispa Posted May 28, 2013 Share Posted May 28, 2013 A flickr search for ZF446 shows one reasonable image of the fairing edge which does have the same upsweep. Flickr search for Shorts Tucano shows even more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted May 29, 2013 Author Share Posted May 29, 2013 Phew! Rubbing down is always hard work that leaves you with a thirst - a bottle of Spitfire slipping down nicely afterwards. I usually regret not putting a bit more effort into this phase, but by now I'm usually getting impatient to finish and fly it! The Tuc is no exception I'm afraid with the added incentive that Greenacres is rushing up on us. So here's a couple of shots of the Tuc mid rub down,... The bit of Sainsburys carrier bag taped in position is to just stop too much of the dust from going inside the model. First the final shaping was done with 120 grit and then trip round with the lightweight filler to blend off any uneven edges and fill the odd nick. Dabs of spit applied here and there to swell out the odd ding; and then a smoothing off with 320 grit paper. I actually think the fairings look OK now they are blended in - or maybe they're just growing on me! Next was a big clean up. I took the model outside and brushed it down well with an old paint brush and rubbed it over with a tack cloth (a sort of sticky cloth used to remove the last bits of dust). After that a clean up in the workshop was needed to get the dust off the bench and the floor. Now,...we're ready to start the finishing process. So to start the model is given an all over coat of sanding sealer. This seals the wood to help prevent the Poly-C from causing any warps and also raises the grain slightly. Here's a couple of photos after the sanding sealer has been applied,... I'm slightly trepadacious about the Poly-C but I'm also looking forward to it! It should be interesting either way! BEB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olly P Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 BEB - Poly C is great, really easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Winks Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 Racing on now BEB Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WolstonFlyer Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 It's looking great BEB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted May 30, 2013 Author Share Posted May 30, 2013 Thanks for the kind words and encouragement guys. So, I've reached the experimental bit - well for me anyway! Applying the glass cloth and Poly-C. I started - as I usually do when covering - with the underside of the tailplane,... Regarding the method I used; I painted some Poly-C directly onto the sealed wood in the area to be covered. Then draped the cloth over the wet wood and then painted over that with more Poly-C, starting in the centre and working outward, making sure it soaks right through. This seemed to work very well. For smaller surfaces I used a soft 2" paint brush for everything, for larger surfaces (the fuselage and the wings) I did the initial application of Poly-C to the wood with a 4" sponge roller then used the 2" brush to fix the cloth down on top of it. Nooks and crannies around the tail were done with a 1/2" brush. Anyway - back to the sequence,... Next I covered the underneath of the fuselage,... And then the underneath of the wings. When all that was touch dry (about 30mins) I thought I'd better have a go at trimming it. Using a new scalpel blade it was an absolute doddle! The blade went through the 0.6oz cloth like it was paper and I was able to use the edge of the part covered as a guide for the blade - result a nice, clean, closely trimmed and well stuck down edge. Perfect. Here's a photo at that stage,... I know it doesn't really look any different from bare wood - but it is covered - honestly! So now I turned the model over and started on the upper surfaces. I did the fairings first with their own shaped pieces, then I did the upper wings. Here I met my first problem. I couldn't get the cloth to stick to the edges - leading edge, trailing edge and wing tip. Then I remembered reading somewhere about weighing the surplus down to pull the cloth in contact with the edges. I nipped out of the shed and stole - opps "borrowed" - SWMBO's clothes pegs,... The box on the other wing is a counterweight! Anyway that worked well. Next up was the upper tailplane surfaces,... Its a good job she has lots of pegs isn't it! And that today isn't washing day! So, I've done the other wing upper surface now, the fin and the rear of the fuselage around the tail. So I just have to work my way forward along the fuselage and the basic covering is done! Verdict so far? Well I'm very impressed. There is a way to go yet but indications up to this point are that Poly-C does live up to its reputation. Its very easy use, easier than film, much easier than conventional epoxy or polyester and glass. I think its even easier than Solartex. There is no smell and cleaning up afterwards is simply a case of washing the brushes and trays in water. Let's see if it continues to impress as I finish off and then build up the coats to hide the weave. BEB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Winks Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 Your in trouble when she see's these pics BEB !!!!! Glad your finding it as easy as it says on the tin, I did this to a Foam Corsair F4U it really does dry hard and really gave it major ding resistance the plane in question was actually a prize from this forum about 4 or 5 years ago and was a rocket ship way to hot for me and got sold eventually but can I find pics of it ? no lost in the hard drive somewhere Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bouncebounce crunch Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 BEB the build thread is excellent and your beastie is coming along nicely. I have been doing a search on Poly C for Oz but cannot find any distributors as yet and as Phil Winks pointed out, foamies (don't shame me for having a couple of foamies) do well with a bit of ding resistant covering. Water based eurethane, is that similar? would it work? bbc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WolstonFlyer Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 That looks very neat and easy to do, it has got me thinking even though I have got my covering film.BBC- I think Poly-C is water based clear varnish, probably a floor polyurethane but might have something added? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bouncebounce crunch Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 Thanks Wolsten. Cobots clear water based looks affordable. cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted May 30, 2013 Author Share Posted May 30, 2013 Hi BBC, Poly-C is a water-based polyurethane - but with a difference, it has an adhesive added to it. In the UK its only available from one company. I know some people have used straight WBP with some sucess - but others less so. BEB PS Phil, she's already noticed! She used to me by now - just a shrug of the shoulders and "I'll need them back tomorrow" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Jones Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 Oh, so that's how its done. I always wondered. Looks nice. Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slickriff Posted May 30, 2013 Share Posted May 30, 2013 So thats why you weren't down the field tonight on a non-rainy day...you were playing with pegs! The fly in must be close when you make that choice. Joking aside, although we have spoken about your build I hadn't noticed the build thread. It looks fantastic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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