Hospitalised, my own fault - but ?

[Colin Leighfield]

Simon, thank you and I am pleased that this experience appears to be raising awareness, worth also exposing my own idiocy! I agree with you that the rapidly increasing ascendency of electric power is actually increasing the likelihood of such events. The very high power of the motors in some of the current foam models that don’t weigh very much might make for exciting flying but also introduces potential risks that we need to think about.  If ever there was an example of complacency and taking things for granted, this may well be it.

Edited By Colin Leighfield on 09/08/2019 13:05:45

[Tim Flyer]

Sorry to hear about that Colin and I wish you a speedy recovery . I do wonder whether designers could consider some sort of load based clutch on electric motors rather like we use on drills. I guess that still wouldn’t stop nasty flesh injuries such as this though. Maybe a protective arm sleeve or having a coat on might make it a bit safer? Certainly there are fabrics that protect quite well from sharp cuts ( e.g. chainsaw trousers) . I guess an arm “ Launching sleeve “ wouldn’t need to be too cumbersome?

[Colin Leighfield]

Hi Tim. Some good thoughts there. When you consider the potential catastrophic consequences of a slashing wound between the wrist and elbow it does make you wonder if some kind of slip on protective sleeve is worth thinking about, doesn’t it?

[Robert Parker]

Hi Colin,

Just read this, so sorry to hear of your misfortune during hand launching.

Take care and get well soon.

Regards

Robert

[Don Fry]

I was up the field yesterday trying to sort out a recalcitrant engine/installation/fuel problem. And it was not going well, will much starts and stops. And I was working hard, and it was hot, and I was getting frustrated, and this problem is annoying. And I thought of you Colin, and stopped, to sort out when calmer.

Get well. Game of blood.

[Chris Walby]

Colin,

Firstly get well soon and thanks for the reminder even though unfortunately it has caused you much pain.

Personally I think the sleeve idea has some merit and earlier in the year in the warmer weather I traded my sweatshirt for a T shirt. In starting one of the IC models I reached around a little too close to the rotting prop and it gave m a bit of a nick on my forearm (drew blood, but nothing like your accident). My lesson learnt was to avoid bare arms as the prop would have snagged of clothing of some sort + the always where possible walk around the model to take the glow lead off.

As for the HK Mig foame, I have one and its best launched underhand as it has more than enough power to climb away. I hold the model in my left hand, flick throttle hold on, advance throttle to full and then with neck strap to steady the TX hold the TX in my right. Then when ready with my thumb on the stick (Elv/Ail) flick the throttle hold switch off the finger. Just remembering to lift my left hand forward and up so the prop does not get a chance.

This suits the Mig as the centre fuselage is on the top as apposed to the flat underside with little to grip. Its a load of fun on high rate, but do tape the hinges as sooner or later one will part company!

Lastly if you would like my setting PM me as there is a knack to getting a clean launch

[Colin Leighfield]

Chris, Don , Robert, thank you.

Listening to everything said so far, because apart from my own personal interest I hope that the extensive conversations around this event have a value to anyone following the thread.

1. Neck straps. I have used them but on balance decided against because of the risk I observed when working with a plane on the ground, either setting it up or picking it up to carry it to the take-off point, of the transmitter swinging into the prop. It might sound silly but when your brain is in overload, these things can happen. I prefer to have the transmitter on the floor and work from there.

2. Mode. I have always flown mode 1 with throttle on the right because when I started with propo radio in 1976 everyone around here did. I am not changing now, but if you launch right hand with transmitter in left as I do there is a delay before you get your right thumb to the throttle. If it is closed, it can be tricky with some planes.

3. I use over-arm and under-arm techniques, depending on the model. Some just fly out of your hand, others need a firm chuck.

As I have mentioned before, I am no spring chicken on this. I have been hand launching since I built my rubber powered Frog Minx in 1956. (It didn’t last very long) and in the last few weeks I have hand launched a vintage 60” span 5lbs. weight Frog Jackdaw with a significantly poky Enya SS30 going flat out. On this occasion though a small, light and innocuous looking model proved to have risk potential that I hadn’t considered previously, just demonstrating that being casual and over-confident in your personal experience can be a recipe for disaster. That is how accidents happen and the “C” word is evident all the time, COMPLACENCY. If it has never happened to you, just remember that at some point it probably will.

Chris, thank you, I will PM you to see what else I can learn.

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

Re. neck straps, I've witnessed several incidents (at least one of which resulted in considerable blood loss) where neck straps have caught on throttle sticks while setting up. If using one, I would strongly advocate the use of a throttle lock on all powered models - not just EP.

[Colin Leighfield]

I have just had a look on-line for PPE (Personal Protective Equipment) for forearm protection. There is quite a choice instantly available of Kevlar based pull-on sleeves designed to protect against sharp metal, broken glass, working with chain-saws etc. and not particularly expensive. Some are available as pairs, others as single items. I have ordered a pair of “Kevlar steel reinforced” sleeves for £8.99, to be delivered on Monday. They are basically a knitted product and appear to be comfortable and inobtrusive to wear, so definitely worth a look. The supporting descriptions for these and others on offer show that you cannot cut through them with a knife. Obviously a high speed sharp propeller is stretching things a bit, but even so this looks promising. I don’t intend to deliberately repeat the event as a test programme, but hopefully they will give some insurance against serious damage in the event of a mishap. Worth a look. Some of the protective gloves on offer are probably worth consideration as well.

[Chris Walby]

Colin, The sleeves look like a good idea especially in hot weather when wearing short sleeve shirts + with the ability to roll them down when not needed.

I think I'll order a set and see how I get on with them...although I seem to be running out of electric hand chuck models its leaning around (the model, not the prop) on the IC ones where its hard to see the prop tip that concerns me...my 70 will hurt, but the 180 is not worth thinking about the damage it could cause.

As for neck straps, I leave mine off until the model is running and ready to go to the flight line, if its electric then throttle hold on and thumb over the throttle stick when carrying it out.

[Tim Flyer]

Great to hear Colin I think the sleeve protector Is a good idea and it should be quick and easy to put them on for a launch. Many sports and pass-times require it as sadly our flesh is about as vulnerable as a cucumber! and almost any fabric over it reduces injuries. When I mountain bike my “summer jersey” has 3/4 length sleeves with tough nylon fabric on the top side of the sleeves just to prevent thorns and nettles damaging the arms on overgrown trails. The right clothing makes a massive difference to enjoyment!

[Trevor Crook]

Colin, hope the injury is healing well - nasty! Reading this thread suddenly reminded me that my son and I each had E-Flite Grumman Wildcats a few years ago. Very similar size and shape to the Buffalo. We self-launched, but I remember the trouble we had holding on with one hand when the throttle was opened. We solved it by launching at half throttle - still enough power to get away, but easier to grip. May be worth trying if you dare go near it again!

[Peter Miller]

Talking of arm protection. A few years ago my OS 40 FS threw its prop. Luckily I had on a shirt, fleece AND jacket.

Considering all the protection and the fact that the prop was no longer attached to the engine. The bruise was quite impressive. Photo shows it.

Another club member had a Saito 30 four stroke throw a prop which got him in the hand. It too three stitches to sew the vein up and another four to sew the gash in the flesh up.

Even props no longer under power are pretty dangerous

[Colin Leighfield]

Thank you Tim, Trevor and Peter. This thread is providing all sorts of experiences and lessons. We don’t think about what damage a prop might do if it comes off. James and I had planned to go to the field yesterday and fly the Buffalo but the weather was lousy with strong gusting wind and intermittent showers, so we didn’t. However we will do it ASAP and make sure that the kamikaze event doesn’t repeat itself. The protective Kevlar sleeves are due for delivery today and I will share what they are like on here.

[Colin Leighfield]

The Kevlar arm protectors arrived today. I am impressed, like a thick knitted fabric but very easy to put on your bare arm or over a sleeve. Comfortable and not heavy,. For the small amount of money they cost, it could be a no-brainer. The damage we regularly do to hands and fingers is bad enough but bone close to the skin generally limits the damage. However the area from wrist to elbow has a potentially lethal risk, so this simple protection might be the minimum inconvenience answer.

[Colin Leighfield]

The six stitches were removed today and the wound is healing very well. Many thanks to the team at Royal Stoke hospital. When you think that this much damage was done by a 10” prop, it makes you realise just how serious this sort of injury can be.

I hope no one has been offended by my sharing all of this on the forum but I felt that in spite of my embarrassment at being caught out this way, if it reduced the risk of someone else suffering similar or worse by raising awareness then it would be worth it. To say that I have been lucky to get away with it so relatively lightly is no understatement.

[Don Fry]

Ow, ow ow ow. I am very happy to be reminded at second hand.

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[Colin Leighfield]

Hi Doc. Mostly shock and concern at the level of damage that had den done. I tried to make light of it, but they didn’t.

[Bob Cotsford]

Once again Colin - OUCH!! Certainly not offended, I'm just thankfull I got away with past mishaps. I could have in your position many times but for the grace of your chosen deity.

[J D 8]

Well worth another reminder, and it was a smallish prop by todays standards!

Edited By J D 8 on 19/08/2019 18:10:06

[Colin Leighfield]

Thanks Bob and JD8. Safe flying!

[dave windymiller]

That twin sc52 ripmax rapier was mine and i built a replacement following a flight that finished at -6" altitude!!

I struggle to launch this model these days so i am thinking of a dolly for take off (whilst i still can count to 10). Either that or a vertical takeoff ramp!!

Dave

Ripmax rapier twin launch - youtube

Edited By dave windymiller on 11/02/2020 21:46:40

Edited By dave windymiller on 11/02/2020 21:47:07

[Old Geezer]

Very sensible - ideally you could fit a separate receiver and servo ( and battery obvs!) to the dolly to give directional control on the ground - and even another servo to stop the dolly and delta from parting company prematurel before it had reached safe flying speed .

[Peter Miller]

For years I have refused to even touch a model with the prop anywhere but right out in front.

Seen (and had) too many accidents with props in unusual places.