Need to know what to do next and where I will be going, with Ender 3.

[Erfolg]

I almost certainly buy a glass plate. At present I do not know if the glass plate can be attached to my Basic Ender3?

 

I have now tried the Hairspray method and the Pritt Stick methods, which for me do not work, as required.

 

Is there a 3d section to this site? I am sure that there is so much useful information and knowledge amongst the aeromodelers. I am thinking about how to use Fusion 360, Cura slicer and similar products. Then there are aeromodelling specific designs, such as the Pushy Cat tailpipe assembly, servo covers/mountings,along with exhausts manifolds as found on scale models. On the grand scale there are major sections and or complete airframes. 

In the mean time I struggle on, continuing to learn.

[adrian garnham]

I have a basic ender 3 and the glass plate is a straight swap. It was certainly a game changer for me with regards to part adhesion

Edited October 6, 2021 by adrian garnham

[Martian]

Erfolg. no 1 for successful prints is excellent bed levelling , I stick to one supplier of filament for example pla by Sunlu . I don't know whether your Ender 3 has a bed levelling probe but it is certainly a worthwhile upgrade and not to costly. My Prusa is auto levelling and I use pritt stick and can print various 3d prints continuously with no problems. sometimes if the item to be printed is small I may opt to use a raft rather than brim just a bit more work cleaning up. I would personally print known successful G code prints and aim for continuous successful prints . For PLA I do not heat the bed in fact if I was to print using ABS or PETG  I would change the printhead ie only use 1 head for PLA another for ABS etc. ABS melts at a higher temp and if you attempt to print PLA afterwards you will almost certainly have head blocking problems due to residual ABS . Each failure is a step to perfection and it takes a lot of work . Storage of PLA filament is important because it is hydroscopic and will cause bubbling and spitting in the head also poor layer adhesion.  

[Martian]

a frequent problem is first layer warping once this happens sooner or later the head will collide with the warp and knock is of the bed. 

[Ron Gray]

Interesting comments there Martian. I too use a Prusa and regularly print in either PLA or PETG but I do use bed heating for both, do not change print nozzles and don’t have any head blocking issues. As you, I use a Pritt Stick on the bed but do not clean and re-apply between every print, maybe once every 5 prints. Totally agree that the bed levelling and print head height are ultra important. I’ve regularly used Sunlu filament but tbh my favourite are those sold by Prusa.

[Martian]

Hi Ron it was the ABS that caused the problem it just baked in the nozzle so as I said I am prepared to change head assy and with the latest Prusa upgrade it is easier to change and only minor realignment needed. Looking at my bed plate it is a lovely smear of white and as you I only wash it with washing up liquid when really needed I had never ending problems with my Anet a8 no matter how carefully I set it up it is now a CNC router albeit still needs fine tuning . I also had problems with cold air movement but not with the Prusa . Knowing your printer is key to understanding failures that and a pre flight check ? before starting . 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Dad_flyer]

At work we use the Prusa textured plate mostly, with PLA. The rule there is never to touch the plate with your fingers, or anything else if possible. We don't use anything on the plate for adhesion, and very, very rarely clean it. It apparently needs cleaning when someone touches it, but I have never cleaned it or seen it need cleaning.

Adhesion is certainly better when it is hot. Prints don't come off when the bed is still hot after printing, but come away nicely once it is cool. The plate is removable and flexible, which makes it easy to get things off without touching.

Edited October 6, 2021 by Dad_flyer
Clarity

[Simon Chaddock]

Erfolg

My aluminium heated bed as supplied with the Anet A8 kit was covered in 2" wide masking tape.

Being what is in effect a slightly porous surface parts really stick to it, in fact if the nozzle is too close (<0.1 mm) the first layer gets forced into the tape surface the part only comes off by tearing the tape!

In time and usage the masking tape surface smooths down so the bed height has to be adjusted to compensate and at some point bed adhesion becomes an issue so the tape has to be replaced. It gets baked on by the heat so has to be softened with white spirit to get it all off.

New tape is thicker so the bed height has to be reset as well.

Using PLA I can print tall and even offset items with fair confidence.

Hollow with only the 0.3 mm thick wall touching the bed it relies on the 3mm 'outside only' brim to hold it down.

it works for me.

 

  

[Chris Bott - Moderator]

I find the Ender 3 magnetic flexible build plate better for adhesion than a glass one.

 

It's best kept scrupulously clean with IPA.

 

No touching / leaving even the slightest greasy finger prints. 

 

No hairspray, no glues or tapes. 

 

Leveling is very important too. 

 

I replaced mine after about 18 months. 

 

PS

There is a self leveling (a bit of a misnomer) 'add on' available but fitting it is far from trivial as it requires an Ender 3 software change. Software is yet another hobby all in it's self and getting that wrong can render the machine inoperable.

 

 

[Erfolg]

Many, many thanks for your discourse and exchange of experiences and methods of operating.

 

I recently was informed by a club member that the "good Practice" is to remove the reel, then storing in something like an airtight bag. Of course I have not done this. Firstly from ignorance, then not wanting to feed the PLA through the feed head(I found it tedious, bordering into difficult). My machine is in a central heated home office area, how desirable is reel storage in these circumstances? In my twenties (this was in a previous century, it seems now a previous life ?) I had experience with extruding Nylon (that was actually watching), in that case moisture absorption was an issue, resulting in blow holes in the sheaving, and steam emerging from the extruder head (in electric cable manufacture).

 

I now use a card from a clothing label, rather than A4 paper, set feeling for a light drag. As for bed flatness, mmmmmm, in engineering terms, my bed is flatish, in precision terms, it is no Surface Plate.

 

Although not written about, I have had to change my head. This was due to the extruder Nozzle coming out. It caused no end of problems, PLA everywhere, as I had left the machine to itself (i am not sitting there for a good few hours). I actually needed a new thermocouple. It turned out cheaper (almost) to replace the complete head assembly. The long and short of it, this was not easy two minute job (as hoped). Form a head replacement does not seem viable with my Ender 3. Perhaps others know better?

 

I think that I have been looking for the wrong heading for increased adhesion option. It seems it is a skirt that I need. I think it is thanks Martian.

 

Thankfully I do not think I have had head blocking, although I have occasionally noted a short blobby section of extrusion.

 

I will try Simons tape method, I will feed back if it works with the Basic Ender 3, with standard plate.

 

I have tried to print the DF Pushy Cat, Front, Nozzle, adhesion has been a major issue. It will almost cerianly become thetouchstone for sucess.

Edited October 7, 2021 by Erfolg

[Erfolg]

I thought it may be of passing interest to know the difference between my print paper and my clothing label. The paper is 0.002" thick, the label is 0.010".

The two thou seems a little close for the first pass, ten thou, does feel more reasonable, any thoughts?

Edited October 7, 2021 by Erfolg

[leccyflyer]

Standard sheet of ordinary 70g/sqm A4 printer paper works fine for me.

 

If you are going to try a tape covering for your print bed drop me a pm with your snailmail address and I'll happily post you some of the Turnigy blue "painter's tape" self adhesive 200mm squares, I haven't needed them since getting the Ender 5 Pro. Better than buying them unnecessarily if you are just wanting to try them out.

[Simon Chaddock]

Erfolg

The recommendation is to set the nozzle to bed gap to laser printer paper (80g/sqm) thickness (0.1 mm or 4 thou) but to set the first layer thickness to  0.2 mm.

This means the first layer will be slightly 'squashed' onto the bed which not only improves adhesion but perhaps more important allows for slight discrepancies in the bed levelling setup and for any local bed distortion. 

[Erfolg]

It seems that my printer paper is rather lighter than what is considered as std. paper weight. I have now set the nozzle gap to 2 paper thickness, which is approx. 0.004" (as per Simon).

 

I really should have undertaken another print with this setting. So what have I done, yet another design where I have at long last found the setting that provides a skirt (although not listed as such), applied to the slice of this new design. I am obviously an idiot, as I have forgotten the name of the feature, although I am confident that I know where to find it and also how to get to the option. Still stupid not to have noted what I was doing step by step for reference.

 

The upshot is that I have seemingly achieved a satisfactory adhesion. It could be a consequence of both or one.?

 

I have also discovered that there is a 3d section, on this site, oh dear, 

 

I will re-slice the Pushy Cat front tail pipe, with a skirt, to see if that is also a solution for printing this item.

 

I am finding that using Fusion much easier at the basic level now. I am also coming to terms with Cura, Yet there must be better ways of learning than just trying than playing and watching videos (which strangely mis the basics, which they purport to be teaching).

 

 

[Erfolg]

I have undertaken a few more prints. In this case of other peoples designs.

 

The first picture shows that I learnt the difference of a Raft and Skirt, and how to set them as part of the slicing process. This seems to have solved my adhesion problem.

 

An other thing now known, is that although the process of printing is pretty accurate. My machine or how i have assembled it is not precision in terms of an Machine tool, as used in industry. My big issue to resolve for close fitting parts , is a Limit and Fit process such as H7-f9 (from memory) to obtain a close, non interference fit. How do you guys approach the issue?

 

Again, trying to pick others brains has highlighted I have a long way to go with Fusion. I have at present a very limited understanding of how the Pushycat duct was designed. Need to watch many more videos for a basic understanding.

 

As to the physical operational design, I wonder why such a long tail duct, and how does a DF fit to the moulding. I can now see that the front part has an integral Cheat Hole with the Intake. Again learning or picking up others ideas.

 

 

[Simon Chaddock]

Efolg

You can get close fits but not really from just the sketch dimensions. Two parts will come out exactly the same but there are quite a number of variables to set to work out the dimension required for an exact fit between them. The bead laid down is not exactly the specified wall thickness as the print speed, layer thickness and filament flow rate can all effect the actual wall thickness.

I am afraid when I want two things to mate exactly it is a case of trial and error until I am happy with it, even if it means printing just a bit of each part simply to test the fit.

Of course if the item is rigid enough you can always resort to sand paper just as you might in carpentry.?

 

As you will find designing and then printing an efficient EDF duct is quite a challenge.        

[Erfolg]

Thanks for your response Simon.

I can see that the finished print has highly dimensional properties. yes, I know I should have anticipated the characteristic due to the layering process. The extent has surprised me a little more than I had thought.

 

I now want to produce a set of exhaust manifolds for a Do 335 I am building. I expect that this will tax and teach me quite a bit. I will need to rotate a semi circle, then crop 3/4 of the toroid, in addition to adding a base and side elements at 90 degrees. I suspect for you and others, dead easy. In my case, I think I know what needs doing, but little idea of how to practically do it.

[Erfolg]

I have now undertaken a number of designs which I have printed.

However I have noticed that Fusion 360 runs very slowly on my stream powered PC. You may wonder why I do not replace it. There is a primary reason is that I use Microsoft office, for a number purposes, which is the 2007 version. For the relatively few occasions that I use the set of programs, it seems extravagant to to take out a current version subscription.

 

It is for this reason I would like to use my pretty new laptop to undertake the design work on Fusion 360. 

 

The question is can I down load a second free programme onto my Laptop, or is there a problem, in that Autocad will not be happy?

[Kevin Fairgrieve]

No idea about Fusion, but.

 

I use OpenOffice a free alternative to MS Office.

Openoffice.

 

Does everything MS Office does.

[Ron Gray]

You can run Fusion360 off multiple machines as, at its core, it is a cloud based application and requires connection to the ‘net at least once every 2 weeks.

[Nick Cripps]

With all the recent rain, isn't your stream powered PC running faster? ?

[Kevin Fairgrieve]

6h 58m 9s ago I set my printer going and walked away..

Nothing fancy just a well levelled bed, no other aids.

You can get some damn good results if you don`t mess around.

Cura 4.11.0 Standard Quality no messing with the settings.