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Strip advice please?


Roger Dyke
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Hi All,

Currently our flying strip is an area mapped out and rented from a farmer of which the rest of the area is agriculutural land which year on year usually has crops grown on it. However, in the last week or so the farmer has erected a 3 foot fence around the perimeter of our take-off/landing strip consisting of a number of plastic or metal rods with about 3 to 4 1/2 inch wide bands of nylon tapes running along them. In speaking with the farmer today (who was still erecting the fence) he intends to put 200 sheep in the field for a couple of months.

 

This fence is obviously quite restrictive for tale-offs and landings (even worse for beginners) but I was wondering as to what our position was regarding over-flying the sheep.

 

Your thoughts would be very much appreciated.

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Hi Roger, our club has shared the flying field with sheep and sometimes cattle. we have an electric fence around the strip which we take down when flying, this has worked very well for us and the sheep or cows are not troubled by the aircraft. we have no noise restrictions as we are well away from residential areas though most fly electric there are some with large petrol engine powered models and 2 stroke  models, these have no effect on the livestock. I am sure the farmer would agree to an electric fence if asked as it would save any damage to his fence. Ours is powered by a 12v battery which is changed weekly and recharged. 

 

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Both of my main club sites are bounded by electric fences and the flying site is surrounded by either coos or sheep, or both. They don't really care at all about the models in flight, so aren't anything to worry about overflying at altitude- obviously you will want to avoid hitting them, so it's just a matter of common sense.

 

The electric fence is another matter - for some models, which require either a long take off run, or a very shallow approach, we have sometimes taken the fence down at the end of the runway.  I've managed to find the fence a few times, which hasn't been an issue except for one occasion where the damage was rather disproportionate to the impact, as the fence "tripped" the model, which landed heavily on the other side.

 

Bottom line is that many clubs operate with such electric fences and livestock in proximity and manage to get along quite nicely.

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8 minutes ago, leccyflyer said:

Both of my main club sites are bounded by electric fences and the flying site is surrounded by either coos or sheep, or both. They don't really care at all about the models in flight, so aren't anything to worry about overflying at altitude- obviously you will want to avoid hitting them, so it's just a matter of common sense.

 

The electric fence is another matter - for some models, which require either a long take off run, or a very shallow approach, we have sometimes taken the fence down at the end of the runway.  I've managed to find the fence a few times, which hasn't been an issue except for one occasion where the damage was rather disproportionate to the impact, as the fence "tripped" the model, which landed heavily on the other side.

 

Bottom line is that many clubs operate with such electric fences and livestock in proximity and manage to get along quite nicely.

 

Mine too Leccy, livestock close by.

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We also share our field with sheep. When we are flying they usually clear off out of the way, unless we are carrying something that looks like a bucket that might have food in it ! The only problem is that cleaning the aeroplanes afterwards might not be just a case of removing the excess castor oil.   :classic_wacko:

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Hi Eric, leccyflyer, Denis, Kevin, Martin, and Allan,

 

My thanks to you all for answering my question and your reasurances that it's okay to overfly the sheep. I used to overfly cows years ago but wondered if any new rules had been bought into play.

 

On my last strip we also had a removable fence which the first arriving took down and the last leaving put back up again. In this case the farmer has driven in 4 heavy 4" wooden posts into the 4 corners of our strip and a number of lighter plastic or steel uprights in between them with the nylon tapes stretched between them, so definitely it's not removable. It may be a problem for the heavier IC models that need to land longer and flatter and quite a problem for people learning. It will defintely be a hazard for anyone trying to land in crosswinds.

 

Thanks again.

Roger

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           Our flying field has permanent electric fence around to keep cattle off, the sheep just pass underneath to graze the strip but clear off when we start flying. Sheep poo is just a fact of life and flying into the fence is much the same, we have quite a large patch and all have caught the fence at some time.

?Recon we could try carrier landings with a good chance of success

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Hi Roger,

 

Our landlord farmer did the same about 4 years ago, in our case the fence isn't exactly around our strip and pits as we are already against a hedge along one side but the fence is about 20 yards away from us, and divides us from the rest of the field.

 

To be honest the benefits of the sheep and occasional cattle vastly outweigh the disadvantages. The previous crops, which were rotated, could grow to nearly head height some years and several models have been lost or taken a lot of searching for. In the winter the ploughed field would get very muddy. The sheep keep the grass pretty short, and deadstick landings can be made in the field with usually no damage being incurred.

 

The fence is electrified and has insulated plastic handles at either end by which we are able to detach a short section in order to gain access if required for model recovery. Trying to get over the fence without removing at least the top wire could get interesting.

 

As others have said the sheep are not at all affected by the models flying over them. Another benefit is an increase in wildlife, which is one of our farmer's reasons for having the sheep there as he is paid a subsidy to do so by Defra. The area between our strip and the fence is used to grow a rough crop for wild bird cover and food, for which he gets a further subsidy ha ha.

 

From the description of your fence it sounds like it could be electrified too, either now or in the future perhaps. If so the corner wooden posts would be fitted with plastic insulators. The white nylon strips can have conductive fibres woven into them, though the ones I have seen are usually narrower, perhaps an inch or so wide. These are commonly used to keep horses in specific areas of fields.

 

Brian.

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When our fence was first erected scaffold poles were concreted into the corners then wooden posts were put in small enough to allow for swelling when the wood gets wet. These are pulled out when flying although the more experienced pilots tend to remove only one side. The wires are attached to plastic poles with a spike on the end and the whole fence can be removed and replaced in about 10 mins. The only time sheep get on the strip is when the lambs come along.   

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leccyflyer, JD8, RottenRow, Eric, and kc,

 

Thank you all for the benefit of your experiences. The fencing that has been erected at our field is definitely not removable and is intended to be permanent whilst the sheep are in the field. I do see the benefit to wildlife though etc. It does look like we are going to have to be extra careful over the next few months with our take-offs, landings, and crosswind approaches. Otherwise we will be requiring a lot more bin-bags I fear.

 

Thanks again

Roger

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Roger, Perhaps you need to tactfully point out to the farmer that he has effectively reduced the size of your patch by putting the fence up.  Even a non-flyer must be able to appreciate that fixed wing models don't normally do vertical take off and landings.
What is the club's relationship like with the farmer?  Is this the equivalent of a constructive dismissal, or do you think he really doesn't appreciate the effect it will have on the club's normal operations?
By the way, you are not alone.  A fence was erected along the middle of the RAF Kenley perimeter track to separate the public from the gliding operations.  This had the effect of making the usable space considerably smaller and a significant hazard to the gliders.

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Hi Robin,

I wouldn't think that farmers actually realise how much room is needed to take-off and land model aircraft and the considerations of cross-winds etc., why should they. The (friendly) farmer just happened to be there attending the fence when a friend and I arrived, so we approached him to find out what was going on. He explained about the imminent sheep arrival and we commented about the fence compromising the model flying. He just carried on with what he was doing and replied that our club chairman "knew about it". Whether our chairman had agreed with it or not I've no idea as there had been no communication to us. The farmer said that the sheep 'may' be gone in a couple of months or so, so I suppose (hope) that the fence will be then removed again but who knows. The sheep are there now so I suppose it's a all a done deal. I don't think flying with the fence will be too bad for 'foamies' etc., but for larger IC models it will be a bit of a challenge.

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23 hours ago, Roger Dyke said:

Hi Eric, leccyflyer, Denis, Kevin, Martin, and Allan,

 

My thanks to you all for answering my question and your reasurances that it's okay to overfly the sheep. I used to overfly cows years ago but wondered if any new rules had been bought into play.

 

On my last strip we also had a removable fence which the first arriving took down and the last leaving put back up again. In this case the farmer has driven in 4 heavy 4" wooden posts into the 4 corners of our strip and a number of lighter plastic or steel uprights in between them with the nylon tapes stretched between them, so definitely it's not removable. It may be a problem for the heavier IC models that need to land longer and flatter and quite a problem for people learning. It will defintely be a hazard for anyone trying to land in crosswinds.

 

Thanks again.

Roger

Rodger - when we take the fence down at my local club we just lift and lay down three or four of those plastic supports and lay the fence down on the floor, the corners and the whole of one side stay up. At the end of the session they are put back up. Personally I don't bother, because the models I fly don't  need the whole length of the strip -that's mostly done for EDFs. Of course that requires that you can switch the fence off to lie it down.

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Our patch is bordered on one side by a field that sometimes has had cows in it. They seem totally oblivious to our activities. The only time they come over to see us, is when somebody turns up with a new model!.

 

The worst animals are pigs.

 

We had a pig unit nearby which was a total no-no to crash / go dead stick into.

 

VERY muddy, and by the time you had fought your way through the mud, the pigs had eaten most of the wreckage!.

 

Caused a bit of fun back in the day though.

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The fence sounds far more of a problem than the sheep will ever be.

 

I would see if the farmer is perhaps happy to simply not have a fence, and then let the sheep roam over the whole field. They're not an issue to share a site with. My current site is shared with sheep. I'd much rather have to chase the odd sheep out the way, than have a load of fencing that close to the mown strip.

 

That said, I've also flown from a small strip which was periodically surrounded - immediately next to the strip that is - by 7' tall sweetcorn... everyone's landings became surprisingly good in very short order. Everything was IC back then...

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Simon and Nigel,

 

Thanks for your input. I'm afraid the fence is now a done deal. It is erected and the sheep are now grazing in the field. According to the farmer our club chairman knew about it. I suppose an email to the members wouldn't have hurt as it was a bit of a shock to turn up and find it all in place. I agree that the crops that are usually grown can be even higher than the fence, but at least they were softer and kinder to the models if we have an unscheduled arrival. 

 

I'm out of the thread now as I think it's done, so thank you one and all for your valuable contributions. They were very much appreciated.

Roger

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