Engine Doctor Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 I see on Sky News today that the roll out of the so called " smart motorways" has been halted due to safety concerns after an inquiry . Yes it took an inquiry to come to that conclusion! It's a pity they can't roll back time and prevented the deaths caused by these dangerous roads. Why Higways uk hasn't been charged with corporate manslaughter is just wrong. The smart individuals who pushed these on the driving public should be named ,shamed and disgraced. My take would be that they were probably just out of uni with .little or no driving experience but huge egos. What do others think ? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Fry Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 Ministry of transport, no money to do the job properly, cut corners, and listened to a lying siren pushing a cheap quick fix. Old saying, two out of three, cheap, quick, good. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EarlyBird Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 It's was a political cheap fix? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Fry Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 5 minutes ago, EarlyBird said: It's was a political cheap fix? No idea about the politics. But it was a cheap fix to increase capacity, and it watered down the concept to a sanctuary area in the system, and warnings were given about the risks before the roll out started. Ministry of transport chose a cheap,quick option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J D 8 Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 The first so called smart motorway had safety pull in spaces every 400mtr [ at that distance you will quickly see the next one ] When more were introduced the gap between safety bays went up to 3/4 of a mile probably to save money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 The problem is they reduce capacity in the event of a breakdown. I used to drive on the M25 each week and even with a broken down car on the hard shoulder the remaining 4 lanes were still zipping along at normal speed. With smart motorway, a simple breakdown brought the whole road down to 40mph on those overhead signs and we all crawled along for mile after mile. This was especially annoying when you found that the problem was as simple as a flat tyre. Often the car had stopped only a short distance from a refuge area but was surrounded by highways agency high vis cones having a day out closing the lane. Maybe tow it to the refuge area? with just a flat im sure it would drive if you went slowly...no, best close the lane for 3 hours waiting for a recovery vehicle and leave the rest of the motorway stuck at 40mph. not impressed. Especially as the inside lane is always empty anyway due to lane hogging becoming the national sport. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuban8 Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 (edited) The trouble is that I heard some time ago, a proponent of all lane running coming up with a load of data that showed that ALR was in fact safer than having a hard shoulder. Depending on how one gathers and manipulates data I suppose you can make a case for anything, but it doesn't take much to come to the conclusion that not having a continuously available safety escape area i.e a hard shoulder, will increase the possibility of a broken down car becoming stuck in a live lane and getting hit from behind. They talk about radar technology controlling the above lane signs and closing the blocked lane, but how reliable is it and how quickly will a stranded vehicle be flagged up to the other road users? Then there is the question of idiot drivers who regularly ignore such warning signs as we've all probably seen. Not having a hard shoulder is gambling with lives, with the odds derived from some pretty suspect data IMHO and I sincerely hope that they don't continue with them and those that are built have the number of refuge areas increased considerably. Edited January 12, 2022 by Cuban8 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel R Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 57 minutes ago, Engine Doctor said: the roll out of the so called " smart motorways" has been halted due to safety concerns after an inquiry . I will happily thank anybody's chosen deity, for that. These things were always a disaster waiting to happen. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kim Taylor Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 1 hour ago, Engine Doctor said: The smart individuals who pushed these on the driving public should be named ,shamed and disgraced. My take would be that they were probably just out of uni with .little or no driving experience but huge egos. What do others think ? It has become clear to me over time that some, if not all, planners who devise the layout etc, of roads and junctions have never driven in their lives. Just the sheer stupidity of some junction layouts, signage, etc. is mindboggling, and even more annoying because it would cost no more to do it 'properly' in the 1st place. And yes, the 'smart' motorway is an accident waiting to happen, given that broken down cars / emergency crews have been wiped out whilst on the hard shoulder, what chance would they have in a lane 'closed' by a few flashing lights. Kim 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 (edited) I am in full agreement about the idea that a sign will do nothing to stop crashes. If you cannot see an illuminated AA van or emergency vehicle, or for that matter any stationary vehicle sat on a hard shoulder and then somehow manage to not see that you have left your lane and hit it, the chances of an illuminated sign discouraging you from hitting the stationary car in your own lane are slim to nil. The footage from the US posted below sort of shows what i mean. The stranded car is being illuminated by a spotlight but no one seems to notice. I think modern cars with all these lane keeping and other gadgets in them are not helping as they basically tell the driver they no longer need to pay attention. Edited January 12, 2022 by Jon - Laser Engines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan p Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 As already mentioned they shouldn't have been made in the first place. Been driving up the M1 to Leeds and its not a comfortable experience, and still takes longer than 20 years ago!! Bad news is they do not intend to reinstate the hard shoulders, SAVE MONEY NOT LIVES is the Goverment cry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 I can certainly think of several examples where our local council has implemented schemes which have caused traffic chaos for no discernible reason other than seemingly wanting to be seen to be “doing something”. One totally unnecessary new set of traffic lights on a roundabout which flowed well even at the busiest of times was switched off and quietly removed within a few days - as was a similar scheme that they persisted with for several weeks until public pressure (iirc supported by the police due to numerous minor accidents) had the junction reverted to its previous configuration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Fry Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 My take on the video Jon posted, in the USA or in Europe, is it shows typical get up the road behavior. No one thought to stop and protect the crashed cars. No one showed any interest if there was injured human beings in there. I saw cars grinding by the wreckage, ABS lit up, and within a few meters, going for what is perceived a clearer lane. Race track without safety cars, no Race Marshall’s, no rules. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 I was shocked to see only one car cruise by slowly with hazards on and most that saw it in good time treated it like a chicane on a race track as you say. The rest? i dont think half of them even saw it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff S Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 I started driving before motorways were built (and before any speed limits other than the 30 mph - which were usually actually 40 mph in practice). I was living/working in Welwyn Garden City when the M1 and M10 opened and there were almost more cars steaming on the hard shoulder than on the road itself ? I only had a motorcycle at the time (a BSA Golden Flash) and rarely used the motorways because it was so boring. How times have changed! When I have used a so-called smart motorway I avoid using the former hard shoulder simply because if there's an obstruction that's where it's most likely to be. Normally I use the clearest, most leftward lane and as often as possible lane 1 but having no hard shoulder on a fast multi-lane road makes me very nervous. I'm glad they've stopped adding to them and hope they reinstate the hard shoulder on the others. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Engine Doctor Posted January 12, 2022 Author Share Posted January 12, 2022 All the emergency services and motoring organisations slammed them when they were introduced but the idiots at Highways England thought they knew better. Probably Trillions of pounds later someone has the sense to see the problem. Let's hope its not over-ridden again by another government ego in waiting . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Fry Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 In fairness, don’t do a Daily Mail. “slammed” is a Mailism. It was judged that a dangerous places to do your job is not going to get better. And homicidal maniacs, licensed as competent by gibbering idiots called licence examiners, were not going to revert to type. And you can use the phone, and tune through the radio spectrum, and have a heated conversation with the passengers, while pushing the speed limit, eating a doughnut, perhaps while doing your hair, makeup, shave, delete as appropriate. Maintaining the vehicle is optional. Cheap, quick fix for lack of roads. Lack of enforcement of rules. Even lack of backup for enforcement. More roads represent a political decision. But have a look at road building, repair, maintenance budgets, year on year, and then criticize the people seeking to shove a quart into a pint pot. And that is not a political statement, if the decision is to allow gridlock, so be it, there has to be an end to road building, or bury the land under roads, so be it. But this debacle shows you just have to have some space that is not racetrack, a hard shoulder. As invented, 60 years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lima Hotel Foxtrot Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 1 hour ago, Don Fry said: Cheap, quick fix for lack of roads. Lack of enforcement of rules. Even lack of backup for enforcement. Or are they a cheap (ha!), quick (haha!) fix (hahaha!) For too much traffic, a lack of cheap, clean, safe, direct, reliable mass transit networks and a decade of underinvestment in, and running down of, law enforcement? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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