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Member postings for David Davis

Here is a list of all the postings David Davis has made in our forums. Click on a thread name to jump to the thread.

Thread: Coupe Des Barons.
17/09/2019 18:40:32

Don, the level of pilot competence varied from the sublime to the ridiculous!

17/09/2019 18:31:16
Posted by Wilco Wingco on 17/09/2019 16:57:52:

Rules in English???.

I'll have a go!

The event is for three channel " Baron 1914" trainers as designed by Mr Charles Chauzit and first released in about 1970. Models must conform to the overall dimesions of the original model +/- 10%. There are no restrictions on construction methods, our club president for example had a model with a foam veneer wing. I only discovered this when he crashed it in the Limbo at 37.55 in the video. There are no restrictions on the shape of the wing. Some of the Barons have squared off wing tips and the No 2 Baron has rounded wing tips like a Douglas Dauntless. If ailerons are fitted they must be disconnected and taped up throughout the competition.

The fuselage must conform to the dimensions of the original +/- 10% and the pilot's competition number must appear on the fuselage side in numbers at least 6cms high. You keep your number for life.

Tail surfaces may be any shape but must be the same area as the original +/- 10%. In the past I've seen triangular Fokker and spade-shaped Albatros tailplanes on Barons. The competitor's number should be repeated on the fin or rudder but this is widely ignored. Some competitors only have one set of numbers on either the fuselage or on the tail surfaces.

All models must feature a pilot, a machine gun or cannon, an engine cowling and dummy wing warping cables at least on the top surfaces. Wheels should be similar in shape to those used on aircraft in the Great War.

Engines are limited to a 35 two-stroke a 52 four-stroke, it says a "42" in the Reglement but that's a misprint, or a 825 Watt electric motor. Fuel may contain up to 50%(!) nitro.

80 pilots are accepted for the event and are divided into 8 groups of ten pilots who all fly at the same time. Each pilot is allocated a position and number within the group and has to fly behind his number which is painted onto a safety fence. I was Pilot 3 in Group 8 for example. There is a waiting list of ten applicants who may replace any of those who drop out before the competition before it starts. 77 of us turned up on the day.

The event starts with a static display in which models are judged against certain criteria. The flying tests are listed in my original post except that this year the Chasse Renard was replaced by a spot landing competition. Apparently the previous event was too destructive of Barons and club trainers. Rather a pity I thought! devil

This year I sponsored a Four-Stroke Prize, £25 worth of 4' balsa provided by SLEC. I didn't winit!

After running the event for fifteen years the Vol Libre Club will be handing over the running of next year's event to the club at Jonage in flatter country near the airport at Lyon.

Thread: Junior 60 Equipment Advice
17/09/2019 10:14:58

Mine was originally powered by an Irvine 20 but later I converted it to electric power. Sometimes I wish I'd fitted a little fourstroke engine. Fuel up fly and repeat etc! I use mine to teach nervous, elderly, ham-fisted beginners how to fly! cheeky

I learned to fly on this model and Ken's right. It's a whole new learning curve once you move on to ailerons.

junior 60 in flight.jpg

Thread: Coupe Des Barons.
17/09/2019 06:52:26
Posted by trebor on 16/09/2019 19:43:43:

One or two were faster than most when racing, did the engines get checked over first ?

Well the maximum sized two stroke you may use is a 35. The engine of choice is the OS 35 AX which is a little powerhouse in standard form. Many competitors fit throttle pipes to their engines and you can run on up to 50% nitro and stay within the rules. That accounts for the high speed of some of the entries. Of course you could use a four-stroke up to a 52 or an electric motor of up to 825 watts.

I ran an old OS 48 Surpass in mine and donated a prize, £25 worth of 4' balsa, to the leading pilot who used a four-stroke. He used an OS 40 Surpass in his which prooves that power isn't everything.

16/09/2019 19:39:30

Chris, Gerard's Baron's fuselage was built stock. I made a horlicks of building the centre section of the wing with the result that I had to strengthen it and it was heavier than it should have been. Despite the weight, the leading pilot in our club said that it flew, "Superbon!" and the wing survived the crash. If we rebuild it we'll use basswood for the fuselage longerons but remember, they're built to fly not to crash.

Trebor, it was a bit windy in the afternoon but some of the pilots were not that competent and the booze couldn't have helped!

16/09/2019 19:03:23
Posted by trebor on 16/09/2019 18:51:26:

Just watched the whole video yes looks like you had fun. The folks with the cow bells want shooting.

They were probably drunk by the late afternoon.

16/09/2019 17:38:03

Team B2M before the start.

team b2m 2.jpg

One of our Barons is missing!

gerards broken model (3).jpg

For a video of the mayhem, look here and scroll down to "Video Coupe 2019." **LINK**

Thread: Propeller problems perhaps?
13/09/2019 07:41:09

Thank you again for all of your advice gentlemen. It appears that a 13x4 propeller is not too big for the OS 48 Surpass and given that the engine did not cut out at all while I was using the 10x8 propeller, I assume that the cowling cannnot be causing the engine to overheat.

Therefore, I think that the most likely reason for the engine cutting out while fitted with the 13x4 was that I had adjusted the mixture too lean on the day. I'm not normally a needle twiddler so that'll teach me! blush

Thread: Forum members' new models: Let's see them.
11/09/2019 15:45:20

Ok so this is not my model and you're all sick to the back teeth with me going on about La Coupe Des Barons but I saw this model at the competition and I thought you might be interested in seeing it especially as the builders were so young. The lad on the left flew it and it was one of the 15 or 20 models which were still serviceable after the end of the event.

young lads aircraft (1).jpg

young lads aircraft (2).jpg

Thread: Propeller problems perhaps?
11/09/2019 10:01:19

Thank you for the advice gentlemen. I'll try running it without the cowling once I've repaired it but that won't be till the weekend at least as the French Army is holding excercises in the area until Friday. Not that I've seen hide nor hair of them yet!

my slightly damaged baron.jpg

11/09/2019 08:36:09

I recently participated in a light-hearted competition, La Coupe Des Barons, an event for a three-channel trainer. My model, pictured below, is powered by an OS 48 FS Surpass.

La Coupe Des Barons has four flying tests two of which call for accurate flying close to the ground, the other two are speed events. The week before the competition I experimented with different propellers. The model flew well on 13x4 and a 10x8 propellers.

In the competition my motor cut out twice in flight while using the 13x4. I had no problems with it on the 10x8. The first cut occurred just after take off when I had turned with the wind. The second occurred after I'd flown four circuits.

I am quite prepared to admit that I may have over-leaned the mixture and that caused the engine to cut out on two occassions but do you think that the 13x4 is too big for an old 48 fourstroke?

trish and me at the starting boxes..jpg

Edited By David Davis on 11/09/2019 08:36:31

Thread: Coupe Des Barons.
11/09/2019 07:48:01

La Coupe Des Barons 2019.

Part 3.

Doubtless all of this will have been recorded on the official video which will be published in a few weeks time. The group photograph, the still photographs and the provisional results are available in this link. **LINK**

Four of the B2M contingent stand at the extreme right of the group picture in our pale blue club polo shirts: Jean-Luc stands extreme right with his model finished in olive drab with RAF roundels; Your Humble Servant stands next to him, silver model RAF roundels; Roger stands next to me, cream and dark yellow model; Gérard is behind us, black and transluscent orange model, Belgian roundels; Ludo's grey and red model is held up high at the back towards the centre of the group. Francois and his Antique Solartex covered model stands about six models from the end. The main organiser and pilot of the No 1 Baron kneels extreme right in the kamikaze headband.

In the end I finished 54th overall, one place down on last year but there were more competitors this year so proportionately it was a better result for me. If I had been allowed my 10 points for the limbo event I would have finished in 50th position.I don't think I'll bother with an official complaint! Francois was the best of us finishing in 30th position,a real case of the tortoise beating the hares if ever there was! He also won a prize for being the oldest competitor! Ludo finished 46th, Roger 48th, Gerard 67th and Jean-Luc 70th.

The twin fifteen year-old girls, Clara and Iris Fesquet were among the three entrants who didn't turn up on the day. Trish said that they'd probably discovered horses. I said, "Boys more likely!"

A couple of pictures for you to look at. I don't know why one has come out sideways, neither do I know how to rectify matters, but it's happening quite a bit these days.

francois and his prize.jpg

trish and me at the starting boxes..jpg

11/09/2019 07:38:28
La Coupe des Barons 2019.
10/09/2019 11:21:54

Part 1.

La Coupe Des Barons took place on Saturday 7th September. My club, Berry Marche Modelisme or B2M for short entered a team of six pilots. All of the models except for Jean-Luc's are shown in Post 7121. In La Coupe, pilots are divided into groups of ten which are numbered 1-8. Therefore, the maximum number of pilots the event can cater for is eighty. On the day 77 pilots turned up. Pilots are allocated a group and fly from marked positions on a fence marked 1-10. For example Francois, at 79 our oldest member, flew in Group 2, Position 4 while Jean-Luc and I flew in Group 8 from Positions 5 and 3 respectively. Jean-Luc had crashed his newly-built model in practice and resorted to his old model for the event. Roger Aubard, the club's president and best pilot opted to act as guide and helper to all of the other pilots, talking them through their manouvres, except for me!

Miss Blue Eyes,aka Trish and I decided to take two days to drive down the 472kms (293 miles) to the event staying the first night in Macon. I bought some white wine there and some red Beaujolais a little further south at Chenas. We reached the town of Chambery, population 62,000, only 50 kms (30 miles) from the event at about 5pm on the Friday afternoon but there were accidents allover the place and traffic was stationary for nearly two hours but we finally reached the hotel I had booked.

Next morning we arrived only just in time to register but soon the competition was under way. We had no members flying in the first group so we watched the others flying the "Caisse Baguettes" round. In this round you have to try to knock over balsawood sticks which are only 1 metre above the ground. Some models hit the ground, others either missed each other by millimetres or collided with each other. Spectator reaction ranged from disappointment to outright schadenfreude and shocked or sarcastic cheers rang out! Then it was Francois' turn. Francois can get rather nervous but Roger counselled him throughout the ten minutes of the round. I'm not sure whether he hit any sticks but his model survived to go on to the next round.

Gerard was less fortunate in Group 3. An inexperienced pilot, after two or three passes, he flew too high and too slowly and stalled. The fuselage snapped in three places and he was out of the competition.

We had no-one in Group 4 but Ludo who built the beautiful grey and red model pictured in Post 7121, flew in Group 5. With Roger again providing advice and guidance, he flew the round without hitting a stick but the model survived to the next round.

Roger flew in Group 6. He had once finished tenth in the French National Championships and he is a much better pilot than anybody else in our team. Jean-Luc carried his model to the start line, Roger took off and circulated with the rest of them. The Contest Director sounded his air horn and they were off! I watched the models fly past but could not see Roger's. His motor, an old OS 30, had cut and he was forced to land.

With Trish and other members of out club helping, Jean-Luc and I took our models to the starting boxes. The previous Wednesday, 4th September, I had gone with Trish to our local flying field. There I flew the Baron with a 13x4 prop and which proved to be suitable for slow speed flight but with a 10x8 fitted to the OS 48 FS, the model flew much more quickly. I therefore decided to fly the 13x4 in the first round.

I had made final adjustments to the engine in the pits. The mighty OS fired up straight away. Trish carried the model to the start-line I took off, climbed magnificently and circulated waiting for the others to get airborn. The CD sounded his airhorn... ... and my motor cut! I managed to affect a forced landing.

Jean-Luc was less lucky. His motor cut and he stalled and crashed severely damaging his model. I offered to help him to repair it but he wasn't interested. He spent the rest of the day helping out his clubmates.

The next round was a pylon race around two pylons. Francois dealt with the situatation by flying his under-powerred electric model high above his competitors but nonetheless succeeded in flying around 20 pylons. Ludo with his model powered by an OS 25 two stroke giving away a lot of power to the OS 35 AXs, managed 17. Roger managed only 9.

I had changed the prop to a 10x8 and I was having a great time flying much faster than I had ever flown the model before and was over-taking several competitors. I managed several pylons before I noticed that the tailplane was vibrating. After a couple of more circuits I was ordered to land by the contest director on safety grounds. I was allowed 12 pylons. Last year with an electric powered model I had managed 23.

Then we all adjourned for a four-course French lunch.

Part 2 to follow.

05/09/2019 07:36:00

Thanks for that Don, I'll check it out when I return.

05/09/2019 07:21:14

Off to Macon today to buy wine. Macon is en route for La Coupe Des Barons competition on Saturday. I'll take my camera and let you know how we get on.

Thread: DB Major Mannock
01/09/2019 09:12:36
Posted by cymaz on 04/08/2019 17:58:57:

Front formers near completion

( I’ve no idea why it’s suddenly gone sidewaysblush )


I've had that problem too. Don't know how to revolve them either.

boris with hispano suiza engine (5).jpg

Thread: Forum members' new models: Let's see them.
01/09/2019 07:22:25

Last year I participated in "La Coupe Des Barons," a light-hearted competition for a French trainer dating from the early 1970s. Click on this link and scroll down to "Video Coupe 2018" to see the mayhem. **LINK** I competed with this model in spoof Russian WW1 colours built from a kit. I do not normally give my models names but I called this one "Boris."

baron ready for the coupe (2).jpg

This year, using the kit plan but shortening the nose a bit to allow for the weight of an OS 52 Surpass, I built an inter-war RAF version, "Bertie." Bertie is 11 ozs or 300 grammes lighter than Boris but I've retained Boris in case I stuff-in Bertie whilst practicing for the event!

bertie 2.jpg

However, the cowling on Boris needed replacing so rather than buying a cowling or modifying a food container I built my own. The front made from (6mm) ply, has similar dimensions to the firewall but I made it a few centimetres shorter. The underside is also made up of 6mm ply well ventilated with large holes, then some aluminium is bent over the structure and screwed into place. To me it looks as if I've re-engined the model with a Hispano Suiza! It's the first cowling I've ever built and I'm quite pleased with it.

boris with hispano suiza engine (2).jpg

PS. The wing on the RAF version is not off centre but the yellow covering on the centre section is. I tend to get a bit impatient at the end of a build! I have subsequently added a little Solartex triangle to make the mistake look less obvious. Both models fly well and I'm off to La Coupe later in the week!

Edited By David Davis on 01/09/2019 07:23:43

Thread: Greetings for a noob
31/08/2019 17:39:05

As an experienced old fart may I recommend Chris Foss kits. They are not a traditional build, they feature a foam veneered wing for example but the Uno Wot is a good trainer and the kit instructions are excellent. Please do not to overpower it. A 25-35 or electric equivalent is plenty and please join a club so that an instructor may take you up on a buddy box. **LINK**

As for covering advice, there's a lot of information on YouTube. **LINK**

Thread: interest renewed
30/08/2019 05:01:08

Having looked at the picture of the Old Bill on the DB Sport and Scale website there does not seem to be a lot of dihedral on the wing especially for a three channel model.

With a model that size if I were going to convert it to ailerons I would have a dihedral of 1/2"-3/4" (13-20mm) under each wing tip.

It's a shame you don't live in France. A Baron would have suited your needs admirably!

baron (3).jpg

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