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Avicraft Panic

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Andy Green29/09/2014 10:22:29
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I'd almost given up on a kit for the Panic biplane, and found an internet plan and had a set of ribs cut, but whilst looking for build blog, I noticed that Avicraft have stock so just ordered a kit from them.

Build Bog to follow.

Bob Cotsford29/09/2014 10:48:23
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Posted by Andy Green on 29/09/2014 10:22:29:

Build Bog to follow.

yes, I often get bogged down in builds tooteeth

Andy Green29/09/2014 11:53:42
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Like Martyn - you are not funny Bob

Andy

kc29/09/2014 13:29:31
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The 48 inch Panic seems to be out of stock today but the Mini Panic is available. Are you building the 48 inch original version?

Martyn K29/09/2014 13:44:03
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Posted by Andy Green on 29/09/2014 11:53:42:

Like Martyn - you are not funny Bob

Andy

Ha ha. Are we ganging up on you today Andy?

M

Andy Green29/09/2014 14:28:10
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Hi kc

This is what the order says - Avicraft Panic Kit 48" with Foam wings.

They either don't have any and I'll get an email with my money back, or I had the last one.

Andy

Bob Cotsford29/09/2014 16:07:55
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Have they gone back to foam wings? I thought modern ones would be like the ARTF, all built up!

Andy Green29/09/2014 17:22:06
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Yep, looks like it Bob - here is the link to their site. Says out of stock, so I must have had last one.

Must admit I jumped on it like a tramp on chips when I was able to order it.

Andy

kc29/09/2014 17:35:34
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169 photos

The standard Panic had foam wings but with LE veneer and capstrips as shown in th photo. Makes a lightweight wing which looks like a builtup because of the capstrips. I have an Avicraft Moronic built like that which I converted to electric on about 400 watts which is fine due to the low weight.

Bob Cotsford29/09/2014 20:41:01
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I was watching their site for years, put myself on the email list to be notified when a batch of kits came up but nothing happened, Then earlier this year I picked up an ex-display one from Steve Webb's ebay auctions for a cost of £50 and a trip up to Cheshire. The grin factor is enormousteeth 2

Roger Price 129/09/2014 21:04:32
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Picked up a original Panic with built up wing for £95 complete with Irvine 60. Finally realised my ambition after looking for one for quite some time. Superb flyer.

Andy Green29/10/2014 17:08:25
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Well it was true, Avicraft did have stock, and my kit arrived a couple of weeks ago. Just started the build and will be doing a full build blog on my website, and regular updates here.

The first issue was some parts of the kit weren't supplied, namely the glass cloth for the centre sections and the press studs for the cabanes. It took a couple of emails and a week but they were duely sent.

Now the second issue I have is the wings - they are not the best I've had and are approaching some of the worse. They were supplied with only the cores, and seem to have been cut with the wire too hot, not giving a good glue surface and you are expected to sheet them yourselves.

I have tried a couple of times using the supplied copydex, and I'm struggling to get the sheeting to stick.

I have waited for the glue to go tacky, and again almost dry, but because the water in the copydex is making the balsa curl the wrong way it just wont stick, and with no shells its impossible to hold the cores while say epoxy cures.

Does anyone have any advice?

I have asked Avicraft to comment but as of today have not received any answer. So far I'm thinking I'd have been better off making a fully balsa one from plans off the internet.

Andy

kc29/10/2014 17:36:19
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Best to phone Rob or Ali at Avicraft.

 

Probably a very light sanding on the cores would smooth the surface.

I think it's usual to thin the Copydex a little with water. It must dry before veneering. Normally ( with fully sheeted wing) you attach the leading edge and then continue pressing the veneer down toward the TE.

 

I suppose masking tape could be used to hold the veneer down whilst epoxy dries.

Edited By kc on 29/10/2014 17:37:34

Andy Green30/10/2014 08:17:47
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Thanks kc

I understand that he is poorly at the moment, that why it took a couple of tries to get the missing parts for the kit, So didn't want to pester.

Thats why I'm asking here if anyone has any ideas.

I have told them and provided links to my build blog, so you never know they might be following along.

Veneer is a lot thinner that the 1.5mm balsa supplied, so any curl would easily bend out. It seems the tack on the glue isn't strong enough to hold the bend and form it around the LE without the core beds.

Andy

Bob Cotsford30/10/2014 09:15:48
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Gorilla glue or epoxy and a vacuum bag?

Matt Jones30/10/2014 09:37:47
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I've been veneering for years and this has always worked for me. Apply the Copydex undiluted to both sides with a piece of sponge for even coverage and allow to dry completely. To stop the veneer curling weight it flat while the Copydex dries. You then get one shot to stick it together as it's now acting as a contact adhesive. I do this in the 'shells' of the wing core to ensure I don't build in a warp.

Edited By Matt Jones on 30/10/2014 09:38:19

kc30/10/2014 12:44:05
6079 forum posts
169 photos

I didnt realise it was balsa. Could be replaced by obeche veneer or the balsa could be pre bent first. For the LE of a built up wing I often dampen the outside of the balsa and bend it around a piece of PVC pipe ( downpipe etc ) using 6 rubber bands. Left to dry overnight it then has a curve ( not quite an airfoil shape but semi circular with a larger radius than the pipe ) This might be enough to avoid curling the other way when Copydex is applied. Try a sample?

Andy Green30/10/2014 16:45:29
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Thanks Bob & Matt but I don't have the beds, the wing were supplied and bare white foam cores. That's part of the problem.

OK gonna have another go tonight with the copydex, and I like the idea of pre bending over a pipe. I have 4" pipe that's my Vac reservoir.

I do have 3M 77 and the instructions to make mention of it, but I've never skinned with it, what do you think?

Andy

Mike Smith30/10/2014 17:08:18
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Andy,

I bumped into Rob this afternoon and mentioned your wing problem. He confirmed that Matt's advice (above) is correct. Use the Copydex as a contact adhesive, allowing it to dry almost completely before sticking the parts together. He's more than happy for you to call him if you need any further help.

Mike

Andy Green21/11/2014 13:57:10
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2279 forum posts
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Hi Guys, I have a bit of an update on this build:

No luck with the copydex I'm afraid, I used Gorilla glue, allowed it to go tacky worked a treat, also the expansion of the glue was minimal because it was spread thinly, and would expand to fill the melt in the cores.

You can see how thin to spread the gorilla glue as around the servo well.

I fitted blocks in the trailing edge of the wings to accept the hinges, just a bit more wood for them to bite on. The trailing edge was stuck on using the supplied copydex and it worked fine.

Andy

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