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BMFA Survey..via Club Secretary's

How to best help clubs

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john stones 114/08/2015 15:03:42
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Received an email on clubs behalf from BMFA, it's a survey asking questions you may wish to answer about the make up of your club and it's members, in it you have the opportunity to express your opinion via your club Secretary, they are asking are you happy with certain things...if not do you have any suggestions that may improve matters. All seems fair enough to me so we'll be filling it in. If you think some things could be done better, now's your chance to give some feedback.

John

Cuban814/08/2015 16:29:19
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So, it's a BMFA survey gathering members' opinions on BMFA members' clubs? indecision

john stones 114/08/2015 16:46:18
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No C8, I read it as BMFA asking questions so they can understand make up of clubs, to better help if/when needed.

Clubs opinion is asked on survey about how they feel about the BMFA communicates amongst other things.

John

Cuban814/08/2015 17:08:00
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OK.

Be interesting to see what response they get.........................survey?...........what survey?wink

C8

Erfolg14/08/2015 17:30:45
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It would be wrong to take umbrage, thinking that the survey is ignoring BMFA members views.

The survey is a trawl of what clubs actually do, and to some extent why they do, or do not do various aspects of operating as a club.

I will be honest that there are one or two aspects which I am unaware of, and have been somewhat surprised that they could be issues for clubs. Again, some of these things could be covered in the BMFA news, again what is the BMFA stance etc. Instead of going into overkill on safety, highlighting threats to club finances and viability would be far more relevant. I know my favourite whinge, I take safety as a given, a chronic issue, some things are current and could be very real threats.

Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator14/08/2015 18:50:35
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Full marks to BMFA then! We have complained many times (well some of us have! - me included!) that their communications are rubbish and they make no serious effort to listen to the membership. Well, maybe they have listened. So good luck to them and full marks for that and I'll do all I can to ensure our club makes a full and representative response. Personally I think it is beholden on those of us who have complained to engage with this in good faith in the hope that it represents a genuine change in attitude and heralds a more positive dialogue.

BEB

john stones 114/08/2015 19:05:24
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Yes, done my share of grumbling, one or two questions aimed at using club fields for a comp or fund raising events, sounds interesting but members will have to decide that.

John

MattyB15/08/2015 01:57:54
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They do ask rather a large number of questions about current fees, membership numbers and if your club is prepared to fundraise - I wonder why... sarcastic Suffice to say we will not be giving them a top rating for comms either!

Edited By MattyB on 15/08/2015 01:58:28

john stones 115/08/2015 13:23:06
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Yes there's a bit of that, it's not compulsory to fill it in nor offer your field for anything though, might be there's some fun to be had hosting a comp or a fundraiser. Club meeting Monday night so it'll get put to the members.

My feeling is maybe I've done enough grumbling and it's time to offer a bit of help and see how it go's.

John

John Privett15/08/2015 13:40:53
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Posted by MattyB on 15/08/2015 01:57:54:

They do ask rather a large number of questions about current fees, membership numbers and if your club is prepared to fundraise

Large number?

5. How many members do you have?

6. How many of those members are juniors? (Below 18)

7. Does your club have a joining fee?
 
8. How much are your annual club subscriptions?
 
80. The BMFA is evaluating the feasibility of establishing a National Model Flying Centre. Would
your club consider running some fund raising events to assist such a project?
 
81. Would your club consider making a donation towards a National Model Flying Centre
project?
 
I'd hardly consider 5 questions out of 82 a "large number".
Erfolg16/08/2015 15:10:39
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I can understand Mattys, concerns. It does help to to state why a survey is being undertaken. A typical survey by David, might pose the question, how many people fly mode 1 or 2 etc.

It does seem that there is an emphasis on seeking who will support fund raising activities in support of a NFC.

There does seem to be an unspoken query with respect to club fees, how much could the BMFA realistically move annual fees towards a higher BMFA content.

I do not know how to take the business rate, or the limited company question. This an issue which may benefit from an explanation of when and how it would be relevant, to model aircraft clubs.

Matty may possibly be right, if he is suspecting, that the BMFA is looking to construct a multi thread approach to fund raising.

My stance has hardened, our club as a body does not support the NFC. Those who do, should be the only ones who should be asked and expected to fund it. If individual members of the club wish to make donations, great.

Above all i do not want the BMFA to loose focus on issues that effect all clubs and members, to the notion of a NFC.

Andy Symons - BMFA16/08/2015 21:31:36
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The primary purpose of the survey is so I can gather information on how many clubs have been affected by the non domestic business rates system, but it made sense to me to broaden out to gather other information that we don't have and of course whether clubs are happy with communication from the BMFA and BMFA areas and how it can be improved, clubs of course do not have to supply the information if they choose not to.

It made sense to ask clubs if they would be prepared to host examiner workshops and competitions, and also about fundraising with regards to any future national centre. 2 questions on the national centre can hardly be described as an "emphasis" either and it would have been rather silly not to ask.

Gary Manuel16/08/2015 21:54:26
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Any direct communication between BMFA and clubs / members is always welcome.

It's reassuring that the BMFA is taking an interest in club matters.

Martin Harris16/08/2015 22:01:35
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yes

Erfolg16/08/2015 23:46:46
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It does appear that non domestic business rates is a potential issue for many clubs, which is mentioned, yet little additional information is provided.

It does appear that there could be an avenue that most clubs could be considered as potential charities, in that all member of the community are welcome to join as a broad catholic view to whoever they may be, what ever gender, what ever their age. We also as a movement have an educational component etc, in addition we are a air sport. Of course there may disadvantages to this status, which i am unaware of.

Then there is the question of payment. It seems that at a practical stand point, formal arrangements are not as advantageous as being allowed to make use of fields, as a favour. Also that any gifts made to the landowner are not regular, or of a predetermined amount. In essence just a gesture of appreciation. Again advice on the niceties of the language which should be used and practises to be avoided, would be helpful to many club officials. For instance that contributions for field use are voluntary, not a component of club fees and that the gifts to the land owner is to show how much their help is appreciated, and not a contractual arrangement.

There does appear to many ad-hoc favours made to clubs, that could fall foul of the NDBR by ignorance of club officials, that guidance is very necessary. Just to ensure that the careless use of language does not compromise clubs. I essence help us to help ourselves.

As to the NFC, I have little interest, which at present is the club position.

Jon Laughton17/08/2015 09:04:53
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I for one am glad that this survey was commissioned as like many I believe there is scope for improving the all round relationships between clubs and the BMFA

There are boxes that can be filled in with relevant comments which should provide a diversity of responses for the BMFA to consider and respond to. At Chairman's conferences I have been stunned that there was no real data on such things as how many of the paid up members are active flyers and in which disciplines...so for me this is a step forward.

On the issue communication with clubs I can only say that I find Andy Symons and the others in the management team (not the council) to be easily accessible and responsive to my queries or concerns...so well done to them..

Jon

kc17/08/2015 09:59:22
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It seems to me that this may be an underhand way of pretending that they have asked all the BMFA members for their views on a National Flying Centre! If they want members views they should ask every individual BMFA member.

Just asking club officials allows club officers the opportunity to put forward their own personal views and not the individual views of the entire membership.

The question now for the forum members is "has your club secretary asked for your views on these matters? " Mine hasn't! ( But he is on holiday like so many others. But that's the trick- put these things out when people are on holiday and it gets overlooked yet 'officially' we have been asked for our views! ),

Masher17/08/2015 10:26:04
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I used to think I was cynicalsmiley What is underhand is the young lady with a strange accent who tried to sort out my spam this morning and the chap who is going to give my £7k to charity because I wasn't interested in PPI.

If BMFA do nothing they are moaned at, if they do anything they are moaned at - give 'em a chance

Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator17/08/2015 10:44:34
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Well yes KC that is one interpretation of events. And given some of the claims that have been made about the mandate given by a tiny level of participation in some surveys by BMFA and the somewhat dubious framing of the question structure in those surveys I can understand your sceptism.

No one would desribe me as an unquestioning supporter of all things BMFA - I have been more than willing to express criticism where I feel it was fair and resonable to do so and to question methods and motives of BMFA actions. But I'm choosing to see this particular exercise as a genuine effort to put previous faux pas behind us and consult more fully with the membership. Belated maybe, but non-the-less welcome for all that. The BMFA has taken the initiative by issuing the questionaire and I for one will do what I can, in my club at least, to treat it at face value, engage and give what are, as far as we can do so, fair and accurate answers that reflect the status of our club and the views of our membership.

Of course it is then beholden on BMFA to look at the results, including any that don't "fit" with current central ambitions, at full value, and take notice and full account of them in any future decision making.

I don't think we should read too much into the that fact this was sent to club secretaries. From a purely practical perspective that makes sense. Theoretically the BMFA does have members email addresses but my guess is that is somewhat flakey and unreliable database (due to some people not providing the information and others failing to update the information when it changes). But the database with the emails of club secs is probably pretty solid and reliable. Hence it makes sense to use that.

BEB

Edited By Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator on 17/08/2015 10:45:31

Martin Harris17/08/2015 11:08:08
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One thought provoking part of the survey was on the subject of area council communication with clubs - as we are well represented at area level it hadn't occurred to me that I have never seen any "push" communications from our area...and unless I'm looking in the wrong place, no meaningful database of minutes is available for our area on the BMFA site.

Do/can any of you get regular updates from your areas other than via club representatives?

Edited By Martin Harris on 17/08/2015 11:09:06

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