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LMA v BMFA insurance

Has anyone jumped ship to the LMA?

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Andy Symons - BMFA23/01/2017 12:34:32
478 forum posts
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Posted by Peter Christy on 23/01/2017 10:30:28:The area in which I now live has had no representation even for clubs for a number of years now. Surely, for an organisation that insists that the clubs are its members, dis-enfranchising a whole county is even worse than the dis-enfranchisement of country members!

Hi Peter

This is somewhat incorrect, a number of years ago there was a quite fractious dispute in the South West area which happened to be along Devon vs Cornwall lines, so at that time and with full agreement of clubs in the South West 2 "sub-areas" were formed, however the Devon area decided they didn't particularly want the area meeting system as such so pretty much dissolved the sub area committee, again a decision by the area clubs not the BMFA, the area was administered by the Hon Sec, Robin Sleight, recently deceased, but the new Hon Sec will be continuing in the role. The Devon area clubs were stillr epresented at council meetings however by the South West area delegate as before so it is completely incorrect to say they have had no representation, they have had the same representation as before.

It should be pointed out that when it was suggested the sub area return to having the more familiar area system they decided they would like to carry on as now. So to sum up the area clubs are represented and the system they are ciurrently working under is what the area clubs want.

Peter Christy23/01/2017 13:55:31
1432 forum posts

Hi Andy,

Yes, I well recall the original dispute, as I was serving on the Council in another capacity at the time. This probably isn't the correct place to go into the gory details, and I believe that others are pursuing this through official channels, so I will just make a couple of points and then shut up on the subject!

Firstly, the story I have heard since returning to my home area (after over 40 years absence!) is somewhat at odds with my recollections of what Council was told at the time. But more to the point, there are some here who dispute that the decision to disband the sub-area committee was widely supported by the clubs. I wasn't here at the time, so I can't confirm or deny that. All I can report is what I have been told!

Regarding Devon being represented, I am aware of how the situation was meant to be handled. However, that doesn't seem to have happened in practice. Speaking to the secretaries of the three clubs to which I belong reveals that there appears to have been no consultation at all with the clubs on any of the current "hot topics" - or indeed any other topics - for a number of years. Its interesting that you say that the clubs were still represented by a delegate. How can anyone represent without consultation? And aren't delegates meant to be elected at regular intervals? When was the last election? Where are the minutes?

Note that I'm not accusing anyone of impropriety! I know there was a big bust-up in the past. But it does seem that a "black hole" has been left in the South-West area, and perhaps it needs revisiting!

Now I'm going to shut up, as promised!

--

Pete

Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator23/01/2017 13:59:29
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Moderator
15748 forum posts
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@JohnF - yopu cannot compare parliamentary democracy with the classical; "block vote" we have here. The first elects a full time representatives aligned with political party manifestos. Its a complete red herring.

Nearly every trade union, professional body and hobby organisation I am aware of has abandoned the block-vote - why should we be so special? Why is it so impractical for us, but not them? Also, BMFA manage one-member-one-vote for the election of officials perfectly well - its not impractical then, so why is it so impractical for other important issues? And finally, if standing up for for democratic accountability is just me riding my own views and refusing to accept "no" for an answer, well so be it. I'm proud to do so and will continue to do so. Sometimes you just have to support what's right and fair. That country members pay the same as me but have no say is just not fair and needs to be changed. If that requires other changes to things that are inadequate anyway - well so be it.

Picking up on some other points - no, I would not see one-member-one-vote being used to decide day-to-day issues either. That is why you appoint employees and elected executive officials. But I would expect it to be used on any major decisions that involved investment, the future of the organisation, significant changes to the organisation's constitution or articles of association as well as for the election of officials (where it is already used as mentioned above).

Peter - thank you for your comments. I have never been nor am I "anti-BMFA" I just want it to be fair, accountable and engaged with its members in as democratic a fashion as reasonably possible. It seems you share a similar aspiration!

BEB

Edited By Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator on 23/01/2017 14:02:15

ken anderson.23/01/2017 14:24:03
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8409 forum posts
772 photos

three cheers for the BMFA/LMA and all the rest......for not a lot of money. They look after our interests. Impossible to please everyone......

ken Anderson...ne...1....... bmfa/lma dept.

Andy4823/01/2017 16:37:03
1344 forum posts
1 photos

I gather both organisations use the same insurance company. Has anyone questioned the quality of this insurance?

Our club's experience is little short of shocking. We were broken into at the beginning of October and all our ground equipment was stolen. The police tracked down the culprits in days, assessors were on the scene quickly and agreed that some items could not be recovered and the major item, the mower, had been damaged beyond repair during the theft. A reimbursement sum was quickly agreed and we were assured of a cheque within two weeks by BMFA.

Here we are 3 and a half months later and the insurance company has still not paid up despite many many phone calls and emails by our Chairman. These delays are due entirely down to the insurance company's many mistakes and incompetence in the handling of the claim.

Thankfully the grass stopped growing at the time of the theft. Can you imagine the level of inconvenience to members had this happened at any other time of the year?

john stones 123/01/2017 16:45:28
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10381 forum posts
1475 photos

Must be annoying Andy

One of our members had a claim and he didn't follow proper procedure, however he spoke to the BMFA and help was given, and the claim was paid out promptly.

John

Peter Christy23/01/2017 17:04:11
1432 forum posts

Andy, who has your chairman being phoning? The insurers or the BMFA? Forget going direct to the insurers, pursue it through the BMFA would be my advice!

--

Pete

Andy4823/01/2017 18:58:59
1344 forum posts
1 photos

Both!

Its far more than annoying. We cannot begin to replace the items until the money arrives.

john stones 123/01/2017 20:58:03
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10381 forum posts
1475 photos
Posted by LMA Dave on 22/01/2017 22:58:18:
Posted by PatMc on 22/01/2017 21:12:17:

Is LMA membership without their insurance available ?

If you are a BMFA member then no as that offer is not available to LMA members from the BMFA it is as simple as that. As it has been stated time and time again you have to be a BMFA member to be in a BMFA affiliated club, and as some one has stated there are around 800 clubs affiliated to the BMFA. If you are not in one of the 800 clubs and don't fly at any BMFA clubs, then its up to you who you get insure with.

PS... On the large model theme, which as also been thrown up. I will state again, you don't have to have or be interested in an over 20kg model to be a member of the LMA, we don't fly these models every time we go flying. Most of us if not all of us fly so called club size models (whatever size that is) normally. I manly fly small electrics.

I would like to know, how can you "look manly" flying small lecky models face 1

John

Andy Symons - BMFA23/01/2017 21:07:43
478 forum posts
1 photos
Posted by LMA Dave on 22/01/2017 22:58:18:
Posted by PatMc on 22/01/2017 21:12:17:

Is LMA membership without their insurance available ?

If you are a BMFA member then no as that offer is not available to LMA members from the BMFA it is as simple as that.

The BMFA put forward that offer a couple of years ago, however it was rejected.

LMA Dave23/01/2017 23:11:15
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221 forum posts
75 photos
Posted by Andy Symons - BMFA on 23/01/2017 21:07:43:
Posted by LMA Dave on 22/01/2017 22:58:18:
Posted by PatMc on 22/01/2017 21:12:17:

Is LMA membership without their insurance available ?

If you are a BMFA member then no as that offer is not available to LMA members from the BMFA it is as simple as that.

The BMFA put forward that offer a couple of years ago, however it was rejected.

Yes you are right Andy, but it wasn't the BMFA that put it forward, it was a joint agreement, but the LMA membership rejected it at the AGM, much to the surprise of the committee which I am one of. But that is our voting system OMOV. So you see it doesn't always go the way you want it, doesn't mean we have give up on the idea, I am sure it will come around again.

 

Edited By LMA Dave on 23/01/2017 23:22:16

LMA Dave23/01/2017 23:18:10
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221 forum posts
75 photos
Posted by john stones 1 on 23/01/2017 20:58:03:
Posted by LMA Dave on 22/01/2017 22:58:18:
Posted by PatMc on 22/01/2017 21:12:17:

PS... On the large model theme, which as also been thrown up. I will state again, you don't have to have or be interested in an over 20kg model to be a member of the LMA, we don't fly these models every time we go flying. Most of us if not all of us fly so called club size models (whatever size that is) normally. I manly fly small electrics.

I would like to know, how can you "look manly" flying small lecky models face 1

John

As manly as the chairman of the LMA and many others, we all fly them, We where at Woodford yesterday in the snow, well what there was of it, flying, then we when into the Avro Heritage Centre for a nice warm coffee and a cake.

ChrisB23/01/2017 23:22:17
1217 forum posts
34 photos

I bet that was a sight...men on an airfield in January wearing shorts and t-shirts.....you're all Northerners aren't you, not like the nesh southerners ? laugh

john stones 123/01/2017 23:23:44
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10381 forum posts
1475 photos

Pretty much agree with Martin, looked to me the top table would not only look at it, but sort it out, difficult to move from BMFA as things stand, but if the wills there it can be done.

John

LMA Dave24/01/2017 07:28:47
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221 forum posts
75 photos

Posted by ChrisB on 23/01/2017 23:22:17:

I bet that was a sight...men on an airfield in January wearing shorts and t-shirts.....you're all Northerners aren't you, not like the nesh southerners ? laugh

Love it!! yes

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