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Electric Cars.

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IDD1529/04/2018 08:25:37
60 forum posts

Forgot to mention that on the hydrogen front that another two hydrogen cars (one by Mercedes) are to be released this year and that Shell have just opened another hydrogen filling point on the M40. So whilst very much a niche within a niche things are still moving forward on this energy source.

idd

Cuban829/04/2018 10:23:09
1953 forum posts
3 photos
Posted by Alan Jarvis on 28/04/2018 11:22:11:

Asda provide petrol pumps is that Tosh as well.

Of course not, but I can just see the Asda PR people sitting around in their 'strategy meetings' and worrying about their 'geen profile' hence the lip-service paid to car charging and their indifference as to whether those few charging spaces are being mis-used, as I think they are sometimes. I'm actually on the side of our 'leccy driving friends, although I'd not go 'leccy myself.

If they really want to be a bit 'geener' then perhaps they should start selling cucumbers etc without all the plastic wrapping tosh.

Tom Sharp 229/04/2018 20:30:36
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2866 forum posts
16 photos

the covering on cucumbers is not plastic it's cellophane.

Andrew76729/04/2018 21:01:28
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755 forum posts
4 photos

C8

Back to your OP. I thought,just out of curiosity mind, that i'd have a look to see how much my car would cost one year on. Now of course i expected it to be a couple of grand cheaper but no!!...12 mths later, it,s the same price!. Reminds me of an old motortrade saying "19 cars and 20 customers...they're all full price......20 cars and 19 customers...they're all discounted!". I suspect that there are more people wanting to buy EVs than there are vehicles available, thus keeping the price up but this will change over time.

Andrew

Erfolg03/05/2018 21:25:43
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10850 forum posts
1033 photos

Now this may come as electric, as a Diesel it would be so much nicer, I am sure all would agree.

I am getting that vibe that Tesla may not be long for this world, unless radical surgery, I do not why I feel this way. Ah yes, it is it is the loss of £523m over three months, and a graph of losses that look like a e^x plot.

I was just reading that some manufacturers are now investigating the use of plug in cells, so as to make replacement of failed cells within the pack, economical. Rather than either living with lower overall performance or a costly pack change. I am guessing it is the practicality of arranging the fast making and breaking of the contacts that is both effective, safe and simple, that is the issue.

IDD1507/05/2018 20:54:13
60 forum posts

Does look rather nice Erf, though SUV's and SAV's don't really float my boat.

The charging is impressive, 70 Kwh in 30 minutes. That's a 140 Kwh CCS charger needed which might be hard to do in the UK at the moment! Perhaps they should talk to Tesla...devil

I do hope Tesla get it together. If they go bump there will be a collective sigh of relief from existing old school car makers and things will just stagnate again.

idd

Bob Cotsford08/05/2018 17:19:12
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7218 forum posts
406 photos

Here's one that took me by surprise. You can't get a Nissan electric car on Motability. No Hyundais either. No Mitsubishi dealers in the Midlands - now to see what Toyota have to offer. PHEVs and electrics seem scarce for motability use, I would have thought that they would be promoted more.

Oh yes, the Kia Sportage hybrid has been taken off the list for now too!

Edited By Bob Cotsford on 08/05/2018 17:20:23

Frank Skilbeck08/05/2018 17:57:50
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3995 forum posts
96 photos

Was passed by Jaguar I Pace on the M5 earlier today coming up from Cornwall. I was doing 70mph when it passed me, looked like a full production model. Looks very nice, out of my price range but will give Tesla something to think about.

Tom Sharp 208/05/2018 21:40:23
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2866 forum posts
16 photos
Posted by Erfolg on 03/05/2018 21:25:43:

Now this may come as electric, as a Diesel it would be so much nicer, I am sure all would agree.

BMW on this link say this car produces no local emissions and I emphasize the word Local

Erfolg09/05/2018 16:24:15
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10850 forum posts
1033 photos

Hmm Local Emmissions Free, strange diescription.

I had noticed that Hybrid cars could be required to be able to travel for 20 miles without use of a IC power source, as part of Government long term proposals. It seems that current Hybrids typically can only do 10 miles, a particular Japanese vehicle was singled out as an example.

At first sight it just seems you need a battery *2 the size now fitted. The downside will be the space required to keep the battery, which also leads to a weight increase, and so on.

I am guessing that the battery size currently chosen is based on the concept that others have mentioned, in that a IC engine running at a constant speed optimum efficiency speed, is a very efficient package. Probably much more energy efficient than a pure electric, when generation, distribution losses are considered.

I have just renewed my Gas/Electric package for my home. It struck me that the cost of gas per unit energy was 1/4 of the electric unit cost. I would expect that this discrepancy is an overall efficiency effect. Although electric kettles are very efficient, it would not surprise me that gas heating of a kettle is at a lower cost. Looking at the emissions issues, again it would not surprise me that gas distribution and burning creates less gross pollutants than electric. Part of my memory contains the difficulty of just getting rid of transformer oils, and some of the nasty chemicals associated with vacuuming down for transformers and switchgear.

Frank Skilbeck09/05/2018 18:57:11
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3995 forum posts
96 photos

We have plenty of gas too, if the anti-fracking NIMBYs didn't keep objecting to fracking.

BTW gas fired power stations are about the most efficient means of fossil fuel power generation there is, gas turbines followed by using the hot exhaust gases to produce steam, gives a thermal efficiency around 60% compared to an IC engine which would struggle to get to 30%.

Don Fry09/05/2018 19:23:22
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2401 forum posts
30 photos

Frank, as a correction, thermodynamics demands, that efficiency is a consequence of the difference between the hot and cold end of the machine. The science does not care where the heat comes from.

We talk about global warming, keep digging more fossil fuels, and burning them, and you, or your children, or grandchildren will die of the consequences.

I will be dead. But don't say I didn't tell you.

Denis Watkins09/05/2018 19:30:47
2725 forum posts
137 photos

It will still be a beautiful planet as the water and seas should survive

And the simple organisms will flourish as well as the trees and the grass

Its just our lot are keen on breathing every few seconds

Don Fry09/05/2018 19:37:47
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2401 forum posts
30 photos

Denis, you are quite right. But the just our lot is the problem bit.

Andrew76709/05/2018 20:00:20
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755 forum posts
4 photos
Posted by Erfolg on 09/05/2018 16:24:15:

Hmm Local Emmissions Free, strange diescription.

I had noticed that Hybrid cars could be required to be able to travel for 20 miles without use of a IC power source, as part of Government long term proposals. It seems that current Hybrids typically can only do 10 miles, a particular Japanese vehicle was singled out as an example.

At first sight it just seems you need a battery *2 the size now fitted. The downside will be the space required to keep the battery, which also leads to a weight increase, and so on.

I am guessing that the battery size currently chosen is based on the concept that others have mentioned, in that a IC engine running at a constant speed optimum efficiency speed, is a very efficient package. Probably much more energy efficient than a pure electric, when generation, distribution losses are considered.

I have just renewed my Gas/Electric package for my home. It struck me that the cost of gas per unit energy was 1/4 of the electric unit cost. I would expect that this discrepancy is an overall efficiency effect. Although electric kettles are very efficient, it would not surprise me that gas heating of a kettle is at a lower cost. Looking at the emissions issues, again it would not surprise me that gas distribution and burning creates less gross pollutants than electric. Part of my memory contains the difficulty of just getting rid of transformer oils, and some of the nasty chemicals associated with vacuuming down for transformers and switchgear.

Erf...You are forgetting about Plug-in Hybrids which can generally attain 25-30 miles as an EV. So "typically" is not the right description.

Andrew

Andrew76709/05/2018 20:01:38
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755 forum posts
4 photos
Posted by Don Fry on 09/05/2018 19:37:47:

Denis, you are quite right. But the just our lot is the problem bit.

Don ....You are quite right...There are just too many of us!

Andrew

Don Fry09/05/2018 20:18:12
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2401 forum posts
30 photos

Andrew, no, as an animal we exist as our ecological niche can support. We seem to believe we can burn fuel to increase that niche. It will end in tears.

Andrew76709/05/2018 20:34:10
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755 forum posts
4 photos

I think we have gone beyond our ecological niche but i agree with your basic sentiment. Sadly you are correct, i also think it will end in tears.

Andrew

IDD1509/05/2018 20:53:58
60 forum posts

An interesting idea for gas generation and alternative to fracking. Good to see a trial plant is going ahead.

idd

https://www.ecotricity.co.uk/our-green-energy/our-green-gas/our-green-gasmills

Frank Skilbeck09/05/2018 22:11:35
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3995 forum posts
96 photos
Posted by Don Fry on 09/05/2018 19:23:22:

Frank, as a correction, thermodynamics demands, that efficiency is a consequence of the difference between the hot and cold end of the machine. The science does not care where the heat comes from.

Yes, but efficiency of a fossil fuel plant is a measure of how much of the stored energy is turned into useful energy and the rest just emitted (thrown away) as heat.

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