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Electric Cars.

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cymaz30/04/2019 06:20:11
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9196 forum posts
1186 photos

I deliver for Jewson, working on the civils side, so go to all the big housing projects regularly here in Cornwall.

Not one new build in the last 5 years has a solar panel on the roof. The panels are covering valuable food productive land. 

Edited By cymaz on 30/04/2019 06:20:39

Edited By cymaz on 30/04/2019 06:21:43

Trevor Crook30/04/2019 06:53:44
942 forum posts
67 photos

Yes, that's where a major impact on grid generation could be made. If all suitable new builds were forced to fit solar pv panels and storage batteries, a lot of extra power would be produced locally. Instead, it's been mandated that all new builds from 2025 will have no mains gas supply, so where is all the extra power for heating going to come from?

Piers Bowlan30/04/2019 07:07:22
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2120 forum posts
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Perhaps to legislate for compulsory PV panels on new builds is problematical as not all new house builds are suitable, with no South facing elevations or roofs etc. Maybe the hope is that ground/air source heat pumps will be fitted, although they are not always viable either. indecision

Denis Watkins30/04/2019 07:59:41
4334 forum posts
104 photos
Posted by Piers Bowlan on 30/04/2019 07:07:22:

Perhaps to legislate for compulsory PV panels on new builds is problematical as not all new house builds are suitable, with no South facing elevations or roofs etc. Maybe the hope is that ground/air source heat pumps will be fitted, although they are not always viable either. indecision

Spot on Piers, Panels are financially problematic

People selling houses are finding that they don't own their Panels, they are leased

And the new owners of your house, may not want panels, or they need a new lease

It is an additional money spinner for Estate Agents and another obstacle for home movers

In some areas, new home owners do not own their own roof, the space is owned by power providers

This is a tangle that needs sorting in the clean energy future

IDD1501/05/2019 08:45:50
126 forum posts

Range anxiety sorted!

RAC News

A somewhat ironic solution though! smiley

Piers Bowlan01/05/2019 11:22:51
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2120 forum posts
53 photos

Fast charging does not do batteries any good as we all know, shortening their life and increasing the cost of the cars. Likewise, fast discharging damages them too so larger, heavier batteries are required for when heavy current demands are required (heavy loads, hills, accelerating). Ultra Capacitors  smooth out these peaks so that an electric car fitted with ultra capacitors (as well as batteries) can be very fast charged and then driven away whilst the ultra capacitors recharge the batteries at a more leisurely pace. Consequently, smaller, lighter, cheaper, batteries can be fitted. Works well with regenerative braking too apparently, if you follow the link to the (rather long) video.

Edited By Piers Bowlan on 01/05/2019 11:27:16

Nigel R01/05/2019 12:25:28
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3741 forum posts
585 photos

Piers, you're quite right.

Fast charging is the headline sales pitch.

But the thing is, for our everyday use (and I appreciate this is my own take on my own situation, in my defence I am quite "2.4 children" with my present needs) if I commuted every day in my hypothetical electric car, it would be charged overnight at the slow speed. And a handful of times a year, on a holiday trip or what have you, it would get a few fast charges to make the trip.

So the amount of fast charges that a pack would suffer, is in reality, at least for most vehicles, quite a small number. Perhaps not something that dramatically reduces pack life?

(yes, there will be habitual long distance users who this doesn't apply to, but I believe my use is pretty much "the average family car"

Former Member01/05/2019 16:13:03

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IDD1501/05/2019 17:31:58
126 forum posts

Nigel

Whilst I agree with your analysis re fast charging you do need to take into account regen braking in an EV. Fundamentally good fast regen is critical in an EV in order to recover energy, and this is where buffering the pack with super caps would really come into its own.

As a real world example I have found when travelling from Manchester to Leeds I use a lot less energy than when going home the other way. Basically when going W to E the car has a much longer distance over which it can recover energy on the drive down from Saddleworth Moor. I got well and truly caught by this the first time I did the return trip in the Leaf, fortunately the Ecotricty rapid chargers at Birch services saved the day. Topography plays a significant role when your electric fuel tank holds the equivalent of less than a gallon of petrol!

Idd

IDD1501/05/2019 17:36:55
126 forum posts

Percy

I think most EV car makers offer this service as a freebie on new EV's. But if we are to have a flourishing secondhand EV market then the RAC may well help this along!

Idd

Piers Bowlan01/05/2019 17:41:06
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2120 forum posts
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Obviously Ultra Capacitors have a weight and a cost but their potential to reduce the number of batteries whilst extending their range, life and performance by being more efficient, looks very attractive and potentially a game changer for manufacturers who use them.

One of the problems highlighted in the video is the fact that currently (ops sorry!) there are so many different chemistry's and battery designs in use that the industry doesn't have any standardisation with the associated economies of scale. A great pity. Perhaps if a new type of battery was developed that was a step change in performance/efficiency then all car manufacturers would have little choice but to adopt it. Then watch the unit cost tumble.

A dedicated electric car policy sounds good Percy but I am not too sure about combining it with electric breakdown cover. I think I would rather pay the RAC or green flag for that.

Former Member01/05/2019 17:55:56

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Former Member10/05/2019 06:46:46

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J D 810/05/2019 08:31:52
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1444 forum posts
84 photos

Solid state battery's may well change our outlook on electric cars in the next few years, promising higher charge density, faster charging as standard and safety as they do not burn like a lipo can.

Nigel R10/05/2019 08:46:47
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3741 forum posts
585 photos

Lots of promises on new battery types, but very little materialises. But there is a lot of incremental improvements happening with "current format" lithium chemistry cells - the near term future belongs squarely with lithium.

A massive capacitor may have some potential to smooth out regen braking. Present day ultra caps are very low current capability if I remember rightly, they are out there but not receiving widespread use, there are reasons for that. The high current high cap devices have been five years away for ten years now. Perhaps they will be on the technology roadmap in the future but I don't see it for a while yet.

Interesting times, whatever happens.

J D 810/05/2019 09:12:47
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1444 forum posts
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I have to disagree Nigel, I recon lithium has just about gone as far as it can. Companies like Toyota, Dyson [Sacti3] are putting millions into solid state battery research. As you say interesting times and we will see. John.

Don Fry10/05/2019 13:50:45
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4557 forum posts
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JD 8, when the technology matures, there are going to be some very big winners, and losers. Spending 100 s of millions is chickenfeed, to hope you are not history, one of the losers. As Nigel says, solid state is only one candidate, and one of the solid state candidates is a lipo solid state hibred, and in theory, if you can developed the anodes, cathodes, lipo can deliver more volts per cell at the same capacity than at present, even without solid state.

Former Member10/05/2019 16:58:50

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Former Member31/05/2019 20:05:26

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Don Fry31/05/2019 20:19:44
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I know we fall out Percy, and I don't wish to provoke, but would you care to explain, how Ionity filter the electricity so it's renewable.

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