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TN Hurricane

queries and questions

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Bernie22/03/2013 13:28:11
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257 forum posts
161 photos

Sorry ! bit off topic but is there a build blog for the face 19hurri?

Bill Frost12/04/2014 21:01:20
27 forum posts
7 photos

I realize that I never posted a final update on my build of it (it was a really long project, on and off over several years!).

Towards the end of my build, my earlier concerns about its weight resurfaced - sure enough, it needed a lot of nose weight added (I'd got the 5cell flight battery as far forward as possible, as well as a separate receiver battery and separate Retracts/lights battery also).

It finally had its first flight at the end of last November - see photos below [I'll post them separately from this, once I've found them again], at least one of which does show that the retracts work! Interestingly, despite its weight, it didn't appear to have any really nasty tip-stall tendencies.

At the time of writing this, its since been waiting for the right conditions to fly again, with working landing lights and a 3 blade prop that's nearer to scale. Then if that's successful I'll treat it to a spinner also!

Overall, I'm really pleased with it, although I fully recognize that my version is only a simple version (no rivets or panel-lines, for example). Now, if only I could actually fly it myself - my thanks to my son Gordon for doing the honours!

Bill

Bill Frost13/04/2014 10:15:04
27 forum posts
7 photos

Right, here should be some photos:-

dsc_0085.jpg

dsc_0173 - edited.jpg

dsc_0190.jpg

dsc_0217.jpg

Bill

Allan Bennett04/01/2019 20:28:42
1540 forum posts
39 photos

I know I'm resurrecting an old thread, but I've just started building the TN 62" Hurricane and have a couple of questions:

I've skimmed through this thread and have seen a few references to extra ballast needed in the nose. I'm building an electric version, so there's about a 3cm gap between the front of the firewall and the rear of the motor. In some other models I've installed the battery box through the firewall and then mounted the motor to the front of the battery box, so that I can get the batteries that much further forward and reduce, or eliminate, the need for ballast.

So, any ideas how much ballast was actually needed for your electric-powered versions, please? If it's just a little, I might not bother with the major surgery on the firewall.

I'm also planning to install split flaps, like the real thing. I've seen one reference to flaps in this thread; any feedback on how they perform? One photo I've seen of the full-size shows flaps down at what looks like about 90 degrees for landing.

Chris Walby04/01/2019 22:04:47
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980 forum posts
230 photos

Hi, no experience of this Huri, but if it was me then do the mod now to get everything forwards. I have seen photo's of the full size and they have huge chunks of lead attached to the Merlin!

Even hear modellers extending the nose a little to get the weight forwards!

And yes you are right about the full size deploying flaps at 90 degrees, I think there is a nice photo of the Shuttleworth aircraft landing on grass with the flaps in this position. I assume it makes the aircraft have a lot of drag which would be useful on a short runway.

Good luck with the build and please keep us posted on progress.

Bill Frost05/01/2019 10:01:29
27 forum posts
7 photos

OK, well here we are! Interesting that until Allan just now, there'd been no other postings on this thread since my flight pictures from April 2014 - I was quite surprised when I saw that. A small claim to fame, perhaps? Anyway, the aircraft still flies, although not as often as I'd like, for relevant reasons I'll describe below.

Hi Allan, good luck. In response to your queries. Nose-weight - I can't remember the details now, but - we are flying our electric on one half of an F3a 10 cell, ie a 5 cell pack because of availability. It was always planned that way. I've got that up as far forward as possible (ie just clearing the back end of the motor's shaft, so that doesn't drill into the battery). My building techniques were very basic, so I'm sure I built everything heavy, including the back end, hence still needing more nose weight. From memory and for redundancy, I used two separate receiver batteries one for radio/servos, the other for retracts and landing lights. Those two batteries are strapped to top and bottom of the motor mount (ie inside the cowl), so that helps. Think I still had to add a little lead. Result - its a heavy model,

Because of the taper, the inside of the cowl isn't very spacious.

Our airfield uses a tarmac runway (you can see it in one of the pix), not a square patch. Therefore you have to cope with whatever the wind direction is, ie crosswinds etc. Because of its weight, unless there's a stiff-ish headwind coming straight down the runway to land in, its a very fast landing event, with little margin for error. For that reason, if I was building again, yes I'd definitely go for flaps, so at least there's that option too, although obviously I don't know if they'd be effective and how much they'd reduce aileron authority etc. Yes, photos from Shuttleworth/Old Warden will show you the amount they can droop.

For that combination of reasons (chiefly the need for stiffish breeze straight down the runway, combining with availability etc), it doesn't fly often. The fast landing speed tends to show up the lack of sturdiness of the landing gear due to the retracts - I'm always bothered that during landing, the struts could rotate in their sockets in the retract units, with cartwheel results on hard tarmac.....

The other design mod that I would definitely do now, but didn't have the experience to do at the time, would be to make the main flight battery accessible without having to take the wing off - ie a fuselage hatch, but obviously extra strengthening would be needed as the hatch would be quite large in the Fus top.

Enough for now, but feel free to ask. I'm currently slowly building a 72" wingspan Stuka - partly chosen because it has a longer nose, for balance!

Kind Regards,

Bill

Allan Bennett05/01/2019 21:02:01
1540 forum posts
39 photos

Thanks for those replies Chris and Bill.

I'll go ahead and make the battery bay through the firewall now; seems like it could save me a bit of weight by minimising the amount of ballast. I'm thinking I might even cut the protruding shaft off the back of the motor as well, to give me that extra 1/2" to get the battery forward. I already have 6S 2600mAh and 6S 3900mAh LiPos for other models, so I plan to use them with the recommended motor instead of 5S, with a suitable adjustment in prop size. I too don't like the idea of having to take the wing off to change the battery, so I've already made a removable cockpit/canopy unit as a battery hatch. No strengthening required since nothing's been removed. My main receiver power will be from a stand-alone BEC, with the BEC in the ESC being used for the retracts.

I'm lucky enough to live close to Old Warden, and in fact I went there last weekend to see their Sea Hurricane in the workshop, and to take photos of interesting bits such as landing lights, wingtip lights, radiator, and exhaust stubs.

Lack of space inside the cowl is also noted: My normal method is to make a fibreglass cowl, so its thinness compared with one carved from balsa blocks as per the plans gives me a bit of extra space inside to install a lead lining if necessary.

Edited By Allan Bennett on 05/01/2019 21:04:18

Allan Bennett28/01/2019 20:25:13
1540 forum posts
39 photos

Hurricane is progressing slowly, due to other distractions, but I have one query at the moment: Because the retracts are fitted into the wing at an angle, the wheels need to be fixed at a corresponding angle on the legs to avoid having massive toe-out when the gear is down. That's not a problem except that I'll have to relieve formers W2 a little bit to accommodate the 'twisted' wheel.

But the wheel bay covers that are attached to the u/c legs need to be flat to the wing surface when retracted, so they will be angled out significantly when the gear is down. Is that correct, or am I missing a trick?

Ron Gray28/01/2019 22:43:01
1446 forum posts
363 photos

Yes they will be angled (toe in) when down. If you look on the Mick Reeves ‘site you will see that he has a cunning way to get round this problem.

Allan Bennett29/01/2019 21:06:48
1540 forum posts
39 photos

Ok, I think I see it Ron, in this video. That hefty cranked arm is twisting the strut as it raises it. But that won't work with the simple electric retracts I've got. His model is almost twice the size of TN's, so he has plenty of space for some clever mechanism.

The twisted wheel when stowed is not a problem, but I'm now thinking that maybe I can attach the wheel bay covers to the struts by sprung hinges of some kind, instead of rigidly, so that their normal position will be in line with the wheel but they'll be pushed flat against the fuselage underside, and hence twisted from their normal position, when wheels are up.

On the other hand, maybe simplest is best -- rigid fixing, and live with the covers being out of line.

SR 7129/01/2019 22:40:45
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280 forum posts
62 photos
Mould the wheel covers from fibre glass and attach with silicon they will move into position when they retract and bac9k when open
Tony
Allan Bennett30/01/2019 11:08:29
1540 forum posts
39 photos

That sounds like a possibility SR 71 smiley

While at Old Warden the other week they did a demo of the landing gear lowering and retracting on their Sea Hurricane. I remember them saying how the wheel covers were profiled in such a way that the slipstream acting on them would force the u/c to lock in position in case of hydraulic failure.

Allan Bennett12/09/2019 19:36:43
1540 forum posts
39 photos

Canopy size question.

Things have been going slowly due to other commitments, but I'm back on the job now. What's been puzzling me for some time is the fact that the moulded canopy is longer than the cockpit, as shown on the plans. But the full-size isn't like that -- it doesn't overhang the back of the cockpit as shown in the TN plans.

So what have you guys done about that? I could cut the canopy to the right length for the cockpit, and use a thin strip of plastic to form the rear frame, but then the two intermediate frames wouldn't be equally spaced as they should be.

Martin McIntosh15/09/2019 20:42:42
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2921 forum posts
1073 photos

I am about to do a little work on mine due to a flap servo failure at the RCM&E fly in so while I am at it may take some pics. I may well have done a build blog here a long time ago and there should be pics in my album. My 5S pack is up against the firewall, not flat.

Allan Bennett16/09/2019 08:21:45
1540 forum posts
39 photos

Thanks Martin, I've checked your photo albums and see nothing for the Hurricane, so a photo of your canopy would be appreciated when you have time. I see in your albums that you have a vaccuum-former -- you didn't make your own canopy did you, instead of using the TN one?

Martin McIntosh16/09/2019 09:48:38
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2921 forum posts
1073 photos

Looks like I omitted an album for this one because it has been done before. I used the TN one here because vac forming is a very hit and miss affair for me. You can easily make a Hurricane canopy in two parts if you make up a balsa plug. Form the rear by using a heat gun then the front as a separate piece and glue them together.

Just about to look at the wayward servo so will get a couple of pics later.

Martin McIntosh16/09/2019 11:45:19
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2921 forum posts
1073 photos

Here is the battery compartment. The gubbins other than the Rx amongst the spider`s nest of wiring is a sound unit.

hurricane 62 001.jpg

The batteries are a very tight fit.

The canopy fits like this:

hurricane 62 002.jpg

Allan Bennett16/09/2019 21:18:32
1540 forum posts
39 photos

Thanks for taking the trouble Martin. I visited Shuttleworth a while back and took many photos of their Hurricane but, because the canopy was open, I never noticed that it actually overlapped the fuselage behind the cockpit when shut -- as you have modeled and TN's plan shows.

On closer inspection of a blow-up of one of my Shuttleworth photos I see that in fact the fuselage behind the cockpit is recessed slightly to accommodate the rear of the canopy when closed and, in another photo I found on the internet the recessed portion seems to be painted a much lighter colour than the brown/green camouflage. The cockpit on my model is removable, as a battery access hatch, and the battery will slide forward to right behind the motor.

What sound unit are you using? I've got Benedinis in my Flair Magnatilla and SE5A -- with 4" speakers in the Maggie and transducers in the SE5A. Lovely sounds!

20181229_113238.jpg

Martin McIntosh17/09/2019 08:53:21
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2921 forum posts
1073 photos

Without removing the sound unit I can`t remember the make but it is small and light. Only really effective on the ground at start up and shut down.

I originally tried mounting the pack flat as per plan but the cg was way too far back.

Allan Bennett17/09/2019 12:32:38
1540 forum posts
39 photos

OK, my battery goes through F1 to the back of the motor, so I hope I don't need too much lead. Just starting painting now, so I should be in a position to find out around Xmas!

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