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Super Tigre 20cc - 30cc engine parts

Help and advice

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Roger Marshall10/11/2018 21:22:21
34 forum posts
14 photos

Hi,

I have a ST S3000 engine and am looking for spares or an engine for spares. The s2000 through to s3000, 20cc - 30cc, are all identical for the parts I require.

I`m looking for the standard Prop driver, collar washer and nuts. My engine is fitted with a six bolt prop driver, which is sound and actually looks very scale, but it will mean I can only start the engine by hand. Something I`ve not tried yet as I will need to get the appropiate fuel, I believe is 5% nitro 10% oil.

The standard prop driver would I hope give me the option of using an electric starter.

Who out there has an engine or parts sitting somewhere unwanted.

Is anybody willing to share their experience with these engines? Would a standard starter have any chance do you think?

Many Thanks Roger

Percy Verance10/11/2018 21:49:51
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7099 forum posts
142 photos

A Just Engines Heavy Duty starter might do it if they still do them Roger. These starters had an oversize cone on them, suitable for larger spinner sizes. Not so good if you're not using a spinner though.......

I'm not sure what the spares situation is for these engines now. I heard somewhere they were no longer in production.

 

Edited By Percy Verance on 10/11/2018 22:09:41

mal brewer10/11/2018 22:43:24
283 forum posts

Hi Roger,

you'll find you don't really need a starter for these engines,they really are the easiest starting engines ever.I ran a S.T. 3000 for aeveral years,all I ever used was a stout glove,nearly always it was a first flick start.You could flick forwards,or a backward flick,didn't seem to matter. Yes, 5% nitro,10% oil is ideal. I always used a 20x8 prop on a 72" aerobatic biplane,a Krier Kraft,weight around 17 lbs. Flew it with ease through any aerobatics,once set up correctly,100% reliable,don't ever recall a deadstick,and never had to touch the needles...……...thoroughly recommended,still got mine,and its going in another model...………...regards,Mal.

Engine Doctor11/11/2018 08:51:41
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2080 forum posts
20 photos

As mal Says, dead easy to start. I had a couple a few years back. Primed until wet and bouncy then connect glow and bounce back against compression using a chicken stick or a thick glove , always started easily . Weston UK can supply fuel called "Big Brute Mix " in their Liquid Gold range . They post for free if you order 4 gallons . You can get them on 01795-522020 or 521030

Jonathan W11/11/2018 11:04:45
62 forum posts
11 photos

Roger, I have a brand new prop driver & collet available. I have sent you a message, should be in your inbox.

Roger Marshall11/11/2018 15:10:26
34 forum posts
14 photos

Hi guys, thanks for the replies

I don`t want to use a large spinner Percy because I`m wanting to fit it to a WW1 model. I bought this of Ebay, it was the prop hub that attracted me to it as its scale and the only one I`ve seen then or since. I didn`t think about any starting issues then! Now that I found the way to start these motors is by hand I`m all smileys again. I did turn the motor over this morning and with the compression present, I realise that a standard electric starting is a... Waste of time.

A heavy duty glove sounds cheaper than a heavy duty starter. More smileys. Although my idea of using a domed prop nut is now redundant for starting purposes, I still want a standard driver so that I can fit a prop, and test the motor before drilling the the prop to fit my hub. So I`ll check your message shortly Jonathan...

One advantage of my prop driver is that it`s longer than standard so I can push the engine further back into the fuselage hoping to help with balancing and weight. I have an 18x8 wooden prop to begin with but fancy a 20inch prop that these engines can run. Thanks to the petrol heads these are available at more affordable prices.

Thanks for telling me where to get the fuel E D, be on the phone in the morning.

I`ll try and post a photo of the culprit in question.

Thanks again to everyone.

Regards Roger

Roger Marshall11/11/2018 15:34:56
34 forum posts
14 photos

super tigre 3000.jpg

mal brewer11/11/2018 15:41:36
283 forum posts

Hi Roger,

I think you'll find the six bolt hub was made by Don Stothers,or at least he sold them, back around the eighties I think. One other point,don't set these engines too lean when ground testing them prior to flight,you'll find that they lean out in flight due to the prop 'unloading' and picking up revs once airbourne. So set it slightly rich and you'll find it very dependable...………...Mal

Percy Verance11/11/2018 18:44:42
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7099 forum posts
142 photos

Don Stothers also offered a re-working service for the slight manufacturing blips the early versions seemingly suffered from. It's a long time ago now, but I seem to recall a compression leak through the plug thread was one of the (then) issues......

And yes Mal, Don Stothers did do the six bolt hub. There were others around back then, but his were good solid items. 

Edited By Percy Verance on 11/11/2018 18:51:38

Martyn K12/11/2018 13:28:55
avatar
4760 forum posts
3436 photos

I think Big Brute fuel is by Model Technics. 0% Nitro, nice and cheap.

I have used it - its fine on my ST3250

Martyn

Dave Wilshere12/11/2018 19:52:48
48 forum posts

I still have lots of ST parts, less of the commonly wanted Carb and exhaust parts. Any 10-11% oil fuel with 0-10% nitro works fine, best with an OS F four stroke plug to protect the plug element in the huge head bowl.

Electric starter is not needed, prime it well (big cylinder volume) plug on you can feel it kick. Bounce back technique works well.

Roger Marshall12/11/2018 23:38:53
34 forum posts
14 photos

Hi Guys,

Checked out Weston UK "Liquid Gold 5%" and its a very cost effective way to buy, so will definitely put in an order for some. They will post 4 x 1 gallon, free postage OR 4 x 1/2 gallon, at £5.60 postage.

I can`t ID the plug fitted to the motor but I do have a spare OS F plug if needed.

I also found a used 20x8 Graupner G sonic plastic prop, which I must of forgot I had! So I drilled the six holes required for the hub bolts but the largest drill I have to drill out the center is a tad too small, just a bit too tight to push on more than a few mm. The drill has been spun in the chuck at some time in its life so I can`t see its size, I`m quessing 12mm or equivilant and the hub requires 13mm, typical huh! Allmost there! I may as well purchase a new drill bit to size as I`ll need it for other props.

Been wondering, how much vibration do these motors produce? Can I bolt the radial mount directly to the firewall/bulkhead or should I be thinking of damping it somehow?

Thanks for the much needed input.

Regards Roger

mal brewer13/11/2018 11:21:07
283 forum posts

I never noticed any excessive vibration with my st 3000 using the supplied radial mount bolted directly to the firewall. Mind you,you'll need a hefty firewall, mine was 1/2" ( 12 mm ) multi-ply well gusseted to the fuselage sides,and re-inforced with fibgeglass matting.Possibly a bit overkill,but it never came loose! Don't forget to balance the prop,I found a lot of props as bought were well out of balance,could be they're a lot better nowadays,I've not bought one for a while...…………….Mal

Alan Gorham_13/11/2018 11:36:54
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637 forum posts
88 photos

Roger, just a heads up if you do order Liquid Gold fuel. It is unlikely to have the 10-11% oil content that several people have told you the big Super Tigres use.

It is likely to have more oil than the approx 10% required and this will impair the running qualities of the engine.

If you are thinking of using Liquid Gold for other smaller engines then that is a different matter.

Roger Marshall13/11/2018 15:35:44
34 forum posts
14 photos

Before going off to buy a new drill bit, I had a very close inside the prop and could see a ridge was being formed by the hub as far as I able to push the prop on.

So it occurred to that that the hub might have a burr on its front edge, I could also see a very light score on the hub. I got a fine file and carefully filed the edge and the score mark, then finished off with some 220 grade abrasive paper.

To deal with the ridge inside the prop I found a size of drill that would take the grit paper wrapped around a couple turns for a nice fit inside the prop with no slop, and rotated the prop over the grit paper until the ridge had gone... just a few minutes and the prop is now a perfect slide on snug fit laugh Yes!

I need to check the balance of the prop Mal but my little spindle balancer just falls though the hole!

When getting out the exhaust yesterday, and finding this long forgotten prop, I also found the engine radial mount that came fitted to the engine when I purchased it. I replaced it because I had a spare, coincidently bought previously in a job lot of engine mounts. It wasn`t the condition that concerned me then, I had a better spare, so fitted it. I left it aside in case I needed a plain crankcase end, (perfect doner to cut up).

So `looking over this mounting and I spotted something I previously ignored. It`s now more obvious and not standard, someone has fitted a nipple for fuel tubing! Thing is why? On a two stroke? Puzzling me! Is this a reconised mod serving a purpose?

Alan, I`m sure Weston UK told me that Liquid Gold has 10% oil. I only want it for this motor, so will double check this when ordering.

I`ve taken some more photos of how the engine looks now, hope the files are not too large to download.

So what do you think?

1

Martin Harris13/11/2018 15:40:09
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8015 forum posts
203 photos
Posted by Roger Marshall on 13/11/2018 15:35:44:

So `looking over this mounting and I spotted something I previously ignored. It`s now more obvious and not standard, someone has fitted a nipple for fuel tubing! Thing is why? On a two stroke? Puzzling me! Is this a reconised mod serving a purpose?

For a Perry (or similar) fuel pump?

Roger Marshall13/11/2018 15:47:43
34 forum posts
14 photos

st 3000 f1.jpg

Roger Marshall13/11/2018 15:48:21
34 forum posts
14 photos

st 3000 om.jpg

Roger Marshall13/11/2018 15:49:04
34 forum posts
14 photos

st 3000 om1.jpg

Roger Marshall13/11/2018 16:31:58
34 forum posts
14 photos

aah a fuel pump? Mmm

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