Should we or shouldn't we?
|Martin Harris||24/01/2019 11:19:06|
8320 forum posts
I don't feel that scale modelling in any way celebrates or legitimises the evil regime that abused a Hindu peace symbol. If I choose to model a German aircraft of the period, it's because I find it technically interesting or an attractive aircraft. Applying a swastika is no different to ensuring that other details are represented as accurately as possible.
|Bob Cotsford||24/01/2019 11:46:59|
7733 forum posts
Same as Martin, if the original had a swastika then the model should also have one, otherwise are you also going to omit guns and bomb mounts too? Better stick to civil prototypes then!
|2361 forum posts|
You are building a scale model, so therefore if the original had a swastika then a swastika it should have. Why there should be any other motive under suspicion, I find baffling.
Just as an aside, my father and two uncles were illtreated as POW workers on 'The Railway' by the Japanese in Thailand, one of my uncles never returned home. Japanese WW2 attrocities, which I won't go into here, are well known and documented, yet the Rising Sun insignia is never given a second thought, except by those who suffered under its symbology.
I never build axis aircraft myself, although an FW190 (the captured one, in allied colours) might be an exception, or possibly the little HK Me163 Komet but repainted to represent the Me 163B captured and repainted in 1945 for testing by the RAF. Eric Brown?
|simon barr||24/01/2019 11:53:38|
1023 forum posts
It's ok to show a swastika in the UK, and even here in the Channel Islands, which were occupied during the war. However, in a lot of European countries, it is illegal, which is why you see models with a "squared off" swastika on the fin.
390 forum posts
Depends on whether you give priority to authenticity or to politics...
1379 forum posts
I recall at one of the LMA shows at Cosford there was a German display team and that they were not permitted to display swastikas.
Also there was a German teacher visiting and he was buying books from the Museum Bookshop that he would not be allowed to buy at home because of illustrations containing them.
I write this from near Ilkley Moor where there is a prehistoric carved stone called the swastika stone.
Edited By Plummet on 24/01/2019 12:54:00
Edited By Plummet on 24/01/2019 12:54:41
769 forum posts
Back in the day I built the Pica / Dave Platt Focke Wolfe 190. In those days there didn't seem to be any qualms about a swastika on a scale model. IMO things have got more sensitive about it. Maybe the Holocaust denial movement has prompted it. I don't think it will bother me when I decide on a scheme, there's something about an authentic version. Incidentally, I found a version in all white with red Red Cross symbols, however, it still had the swastika on the fin. Just remembered I won the ODMAC Model of the year comp with the FW190, there's a picture somewhere if I can find it.
|Percy Verance||24/01/2019 13:58:19|
7583 forum posts
I thought it was permitted in Germany to display a swastika in a correct historical context, with permission from the authorites? As far as I'm aware, they refuse far more than they allow.......
However, I understand if you're seen painting one on a wall, your feet won't touch the ground. Quite right too. It is a banned symbol now under German law.
Edited By Percy Verance on 24/01/2019 14:03:52
|Former Member||24/01/2019 14:07:32|
|724 forum posts|
[This posting has been removed]
|Don Fry||24/01/2019 14:59:06|
3312 forum posts
Percy, you are correct, permitted in the right historical context, with permissions granted. But, on a toy aircraft, you are left to answer the question why you wish to create and exhibit the symbol, when an alternative colour scheme, say Romanian, the same airframe has not got this symbol.
And I don't think it is correct to criticise German attitudes to the trauma that resulted from their adoption of a National Socialist government.
|Engine Doctor||24/01/2019 15:22:26|
2179 forum posts
You can't re-write history . It happened , fact, the Swastika was there symbol ,fact , so producing a correct model of that period should be correct. Political correctness has gone too far IMO and our society is too soft . Its not as if you are celebrating the Nazi . I'm not sure if it's true but I have been told that German schools don't teach about the horrors of there forefathers . It's a stupid approach as if you don't know where you came from then you won't know where your going and the same mistakes could happen again given the same or similar circumstances. Denying what happened is far more sinister IMO.
|Percy Verance||24/01/2019 16:26:56|
7583 forum posts
If we're being truly factual ED, the swastika wasn't a German symbol, it was adopted by the National Socialists, a political party..........
And as pointed out at the start of the thread, it is actually a religeous symbol. And I rather suspect this thread may get out of hand at some point..........so this is my parting shot with this one.
Edited By Percy Verance on 24/01/2019 16:28:25
769 forum posts
I think what we are talking about couldn't be classed a toy aircraft.
For those looking for alternative schemes fro the Storch in particular, this link takes you to a site with potentially numerous schemes, I say potentially as when I tried to register, it looks like the domain is defunct & for sale. However there are some thumb nail images that could be investigated.
Since posting I investigated the link, if you scroll down to the bottom of the page there is a back link, click that & it opens another section with a lot more thumb nail images, unfortunately, they a too small to enlarge.
Edited By Stearman65 on 24/01/2019 16:34:44
Edited By Stearman65 on 24/01/2019 16:44:00
|Engine Doctor||24/01/2019 16:39:49|
2179 forum posts
Hi Percy . It shouldn't get out of hand , just a discussion surely.
Yes the swastika was a religious symbol but didn't the tails face the opposite direction?
Whatever it was it shouldn't, be wiped from history just because it offends a few .
Edited By Engine Doctor on 24/01/2019 16:48:06
|David Mellor||24/01/2019 17:05:48|
1309 forum posts
Can I suggest reading the Holocaust Encyclopaedia entry for The History of the Swastika? It is quite brief and it ends with 2 critical thinking questions that each of us can ask ourselves privately.
|Pete B - Moderator||24/01/2019 17:27:57|
7522 forum posts
I can only think that might happen if someone indicated their approval of its display in connection with its political overtones, rather than as an historically-accurate scale detail, Percy.
The thread has been conducted exactly I would have expected here so far and I do not anticipate it going in any adverse direction
|SIMON CRAGG||24/01/2019 17:34:44|
|307 forum posts|
The latest Dynam FW190 shows a Swastika on the box, but comes with a cross on the decal sheet. I hummed and haahed a bit, but stuck to decal on the sheet they provided.
|john stones 1||24/01/2019 18:10:07|
10189 forum posts
How Germany deals with it is for them to decide, we have films and documentary showing the symbol, it's far from erased from history. Being used on a model wouldn't offend me, certain others that use it would.
769 forum posts
One site I looked at had 3 different schemes, 2 with swastikas & one without.
|The Wright Stuff||24/01/2019 18:20:19|
1383 forum posts
Is it illegal to show a mirror image in Germany? Just curious...
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