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Undercarriage wires on Tiger Moth

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alan barnstable12/05/2019 08:51:15
15 forum posts
2 photos

Am currently reaching final stages of building 58" DB Sport & Scale Tiger Moth and now need to construct undercarriage. I have fixed forward and rearward wires to wooden block but don't have any soldering skills. Would it be an option to wrap joints with wire (as per soldering method), but then use epoxy rather than solder ?

Denis Watkins12/05/2019 09:37:24
3987 forum posts
72 photos

Look up cable ferrules Alan

Copper, brass or aluminium

s-l500 (1).jpg

alan barnstable12/05/2019 10:06:05
15 forum posts
2 photos

Thanks Dennis, but much heavier guage than this, it's the undercarriage legs. (note I haven't bent wires yet)

img_1321.jpg

 

Edited By alan barnstable on 12/05/2019 10:11:20

Edited By alan barnstable on 12/05/2019 10:12:15

Denis Watkins12/05/2019 10:21:45
3987 forum posts
72 photos

I see now

Neat wire wrapping and soldering is the chosen method Alan

Epoxy in this situation will come apart at some point

They do ferrules to fit those legs, simply clean up, slip over and apply a flame

I say Flame, as you can set up your joint and angle, all cleaned up and wrapped

With pre applied flux and solder or multi core wrapped top and bottom

Then apply a small gas flame until the solder runs

Then take the flame away without bakeing it

G194012/05/2019 10:25:44
3523 forum posts
1 photos

You could try making a more scale undercarriage like the one designed by Gordon Whitehead and adapted by me for my DB 58" DH60 Cirrus Moth.

 

undercarriage drg.jpg

 

My adaptation is described here.

btw if you want to use epoxy rather than solder then JBWeld (I got mine from a car parts shop) will probably be better than the stuff we use for wood.  Provided you have a hefty enough iron then soldering isn't too difficult. My iron is a very old 120 watt Solon I've had since I was a teenager in the 1950s!  The secret is to make sure everything is clean and you use 'proper' solder ie lead/tin rather than modern lead free.

Geoff

Edited By Geoff Sleath on 12/05/2019 10:33:19

Martin Harris12/05/2019 10:40:33
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9024 forum posts
224 photos

The recipe for success with epoxy is very similar to that of soldering - cleanliness is king!

I suspect that epoxy would eventually fail as it is less ductile than solder so I'd recommend you work on your soldering skills.

In essence, soldering is actually simple. You need cleanliness, flux and lots of heat.

Clean the components with wire wool or glass paper - degrease with meths or alcohol, bind the components tightly with clean bright copper wire, coat the assembly with flux, heat the components until the solder melts on contact with them (don't apply the solder to the iron tip except to tin it initially) and ensure that before you take the iron away, the whole joint is shining and liquid. As long as the joint isn't moved during the cooling to solid phase, you should end up with an excellent result.

Some people advocate copper or brass tubing as per the suggestion by Denis - it's strong but possibly more difficult to confirm good flow penetration. It's important to crimp the tubing effectively for a good mechanical joint - the solder film should be as thin as possible (it works by capillary action).

Give it a try - you've only a couple of feet of piano wire to lose!

P.S. Don't use the lead-free rubbish foisted on us by the environmentalists, seek out some proper 60/40 lead/tin solder - it's freely available with a little looking around.

Edited By Martin Harris on 12/05/2019 10:46:17

alan barnstable12/05/2019 20:06:51
15 forum posts
2 photos

Many thanks for your responses, have noted all pertinent points and will using soldering method.

kenking-King Design12/05/2019 21:07:17
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252 forum posts
747 photos

Alan, despite the diehards stipulating 60/40 tin lead soft solder, you will achieve superior results by using a lead-free silver-based solder, typically 96%tin, 4% silver or thereabouts. This is stronger than traditional tin/lead, solders joints at a lower temperature, around 220 degC, and it stays BRIGHT. You can find it on eBay from several suppliers, in fact in an earlier thread I looked up the suppliers I'd used, and gave their names to interested readers. I'll do the same here shortly.

BTW, with all due respect, you dear old diehards should try it too, you'll be pleasantly surprised.

kenking-King Design12/05/2019 21:13:49
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252 forum posts
747 photos

Hello all, just lifted this from my earlier thread, so can't guarantee the 3 for 2 offer is still available.

If you go to Ebay enter the search title 'soft wire lead free' and up will pop a few suppliers. One of them, mr. bead, offers a 3 metre length of 1mm dia solder for £4.99. It is type 96S meaning 96% tin and 4% silver, with a melting point of 221C. This is what I have been using.

My second supplier is h.m.comp. You'll see them on the same screen. their product is 95% tin, 4% silver, 1% copper, melting point 217C. I haven't used it yet so can't comment, but don't suppose it will perform much differently. He is offering 3 for 2.

Achieved very satisfactory results indeed, and the lower temperature requirement is a significant help.

Ken

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