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Dambusters Raid

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Jon - Laser Engines13/06/2019 09:15:04
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Found this and thought it very interesting.

Doc Marten13/06/2019 09:51:51
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Very brave, determined and skillful men who gave their lives for our future.

J D 813/06/2019 10:08:09
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Also have an interest in what was the first precision bombing raid.

In the 60's plastic model maker Revill brought  their 1/72nd Dambuster Lancaster out when the Upkeep bomb came off the secret list. I made one and the bomb was nothing like the one's in Dambuster film as when the film was made in the 50's they just had to guess what it looked like.

Director Michael Anderson went to a lot of trouble to find actors and extras that looked like those they portray in the film.

Edited By J D 8 on 13/06/2019 10:08:56

Doc Marten13/06/2019 10:26:07
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Posted by J D 8 on 13/06/2019 10:08:09:

In the 60's plastic model maker Revill brought their 1/72nd Dambuster Lancaster out when the Upkeep bomb came off the secret list. I made one and the bomb was nothing like the one's in Dambuster film as when the film was made in the 50's they just had to guess what it looked like.

I built one also, the one I built had a bomb that looked like an oil drum, not sure if it was Revel though.

J D 813/06/2019 13:38:01
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The upkeep bomb did look like an oil drum.

At my local airfield there is on display an inert Highball bomb. A smaller version of upkeep that was for use against anchored ships but never used in combat.

The local example was dropped from a Mosquito at tests done on a disused railway line to see if tunnels could be targeted. Some did go down the tunnel and there are impressive chunks taken out of the brickwork as the bomb slammed along.

The recovered one was a miss that was found in a field nearby.

Tom Sharp 213/06/2019 16:28:26
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There is a dam busters bomb at Elvington air museum near York. Inert I hope.

Percy Verance13/06/2019 16:41:43
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That's a practice/training bomb Tom. One of several made in a bit of a hurry prior to the raid - officially titled Operation Chastise...... It's the 22,000lb Tallboy (Earthquake) bomb that gets me though.....

There is a video on YouTube of a British Porsche owner's club doing a tour in Germany, taking in several of the crash sites of the Dambusters whom sadly didn't make it home.........

Although generally deemed a success, the Germans had the dams repaired fairly quickly, although by that time some of their restored industrial capacity was beginning to be hit by heavy US raids. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited By Percy Verance on 13/06/2019 16:56:10

Doc Marten13/06/2019 18:09:25
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Posted by J D 8 on 13/06/2019 13:38:01:

The upkeep bomb did look like an oil drum.

At my local airfield there is on display an inert Highball bomb. A smaller version of upkeep that was for use against anchored ships but never used in combat.

The highball was a smaller 'bouncing bomb' as you say, fitted to Mosquitos (618 Sqn?) for the anti shipping role, it was never used as it had a tendency to deflect on anything above a mirror calm surface, something which the boffins couldn't correct.

J D 813/06/2019 18:15:11
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The Germans may have had the dams repaired pretty quick but there was not much water in them until the winter. Also some 10000 workers were diverted from building Hitlers Atlantic wall as well as many thousands of soldiers and guns sent to protect the dams from another low level attack.

Later in the war 617 attacked the Sorpe dam again using 12000 lb Tallboy ground penetrating [earthquake ] bombs but still it held. Construction was different as it was an earth bank with a central concrete core. Repairs needed were minor.

In the 50's during further repairs an unexploded Tallboy was found and a large area was evacuated. It was defused by two brave bomb disposal officers, one German one British.

Doc Marten13/06/2019 18:26:09
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A degree of the damage would have been psychological, a gift to Hitler saying that we have the genius and ability to strike at targets deep in Germany virtually at will.

thomas oliver 113/06/2019 20:35:57
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Not much seems to be recorded about the history of 617 Sq. after the Dams raid. I may have touched on this before but it will bear repeating. ( My memory is not so hot now) Just before the end of the war with Japan, 617 Sq. were sent out to Salbani in West Bengal India, where I was stationed working on Liberator bombers on 159 Sq. The intention was for 617 to support the American B29 Squadrons in bombing Japan from Okinawa. As an engine fitter I had had previous experience on Merlin engines so I was moved onto 617 Sq. Up to the dropping of the atom bomb the aircraft were mainly involved in navigational practice around northern India and bombing practice. The interesting thing was that the aircraft were painted white on top and black underneath, not camouflaged.. They were also accompanied by 9 Sq. My information is that the City of Lincoln aircraft of the BBMF was originally a spare aircraft of 9 Sq, which was never sent out to India. I once saw on television a shot of aircraft WVS actually on a raid over Germany. I flew around India in this aircraft and have one photo showing it at Poona near Bombay. T.Oliver.

Cliff Bastow13/06/2019 20:58:12
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There is also a bouncing bomb at Newark Air museum, It is very like an oil drum in shape. I believe the first ones were clad with wood but this was found to be unnecessary during testing.

If you get chance to visit the BBMF visitor centre at RAF Conningsby there is a tallboy and a Grand slam on display.

Big to say the least. The grand slam is still the largest non nuclear weapon as far as I am aware.

There was a program on sky last year about what 617 did after the dams raid including the sinking of the Turpitz.

Cliff Bastow13/06/2019 21:26:36
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Many years ago I was stationed at Conningsby and on one occasion I was lucky enough to get a flight in the BBMF Lancaster, yes that is me you can see in the mid upper turret!lanc2.jpg

Also along for the ride was Robert Todd who played Guy Gibson in the Dambusters movie.

He told us some interesting stories about the making of the film.

Daithi O Buitigh13/06/2019 23:26:10
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Posted by J D 8 on 13/06/2019 10:08:09:

Also have an interest in what was the first precision bombing raid.

In the 60's plastic model maker Revill brought their 1/72nd Dambuster Lancaster out when the Upkeep bomb came off the secret list. I made one and the bomb was nothing like the one's in Dambuster film as when the film was made in the 50's they just had to guess what it looked like.

Director Michael Anderson went to a lot of trouble to find actors and extras that looked like those they portray in the film.

Edited By J D 8 on 13/06/2019 10:08:56

Actually they weren't allowed to guess what it looked like - when the film was made the bomb was still on the secret list so Air Ministry bods were hovering around to make certain that it looked nothing like the real thing.

Even the newsreel clip of the tests had the bomb blotted out by the censor - what looks like a bouncing ball was a painted spot on the film.

Then there was the Grand Slam parked for years at the gate of RAFScampton - when they went to move it for road works, it seemed heavier than it should have been. On checking they found it was still full of torpex

Edited By Daithi O Buitigh on 13/06/2019 23:30:56

Tom Sharp 214/06/2019 01:05:17
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Posted by Cliff Bastow on 13/06/2019 21:26:36:

Many years ago I was stationed at Conningsby and on one occasion I was lucky enough to get a flight in the BBMF Lancaster, yes that is me you can see in the mid upper turret!lanc2.jpg

Also along for the ride was Robert Todd who played Guy Gibson in the Dambusters movie.

He told us some interesting stories about the making of the film.

Was Robert Todd the brother of Richard Todd? laugh

zz14/06/2019 01:07:27
98 forum posts
1 photos

THE DAMBUSTER RAID by John Sweetman, Arms and Armour, 1982, appears to be a good book on the subject. Covers everything from theory, development, training, attack and more . May have been over shadowed by later works, it still looks good.

AUSTRALIA'S DAMBUSTERS, Colin Burgess, 2003, also a good read, but probably of little interest to those in the UK.

trevor wood 214/06/2019 01:20:48
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Interesting radio series by the Australian Broadcasting Company from 65 years ago telling the story of the Dambusters raid, and what 617sqn did next. Much better than listening to Radio 4's 'Book at Bedtime'

**LINK**

Tom Sharp 214/06/2019 01:21:26
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The real value of the Dambusters raid was the world wide publicity generated. British Bombers were freely able to enter German airspace and do considerable damage. And next day Mosquito photo planes were able to fly in and picture the damage. The Nazi's were very hot on propaganda and this did not go down well in Berlin.

Daithi O Buitigh14/06/2019 06:29:11
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The Australian radio documentary wasa 26 part dramatisation of the original 'Dam Busters' book by Paul Brickhill (I read both that and Gibson's 'Enemy Coast Ahead' while I was still at school)who did receive some assistance from the Air Ministry in research and it did cover a lot of events post the original raids - the Bielefeld Viaduct, the U-boat pens, the Tirpitz (the Navy claimed it wasn't sunk because, although the bottom was blown off and it was resting upright on the sea bed, the decks were still above water).

They were posted to the Far East but the Japanese surrendered first (a comment quoted in Brickhill's book was "They must have heard we were coming"

Cliff Bastow14/06/2019 17:14:56
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Posted by Tom Sharp 2 on 14/06/2019 01:05:17:

 

Was Robert Todd the brother of Richard Todd? laugh

 

Yes sorry bit of a senior moment there! I meant Richard .

 

Edited By Cliff Bastow on 14/06/2019 17:15:23

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