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The Gov't, CAA, BMFA & UAV legislation thread

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Steve J11/12/2019 18:18:26
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Posted by Colin Naylar on 11/12/2019 17:56:19:

If I take a friend to watch and he asks to have a go, does he have to have passed the online test and paid the £9 ?

Test - yes; £9 - no.

**LINK**

Martin Harris11/12/2019 18:20:13
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However stupid it may seem to those who fly models responsibly, these are the current rules. I have little doubt that the BMFA will have this anomaly on their CAA discussion agenda.

P.S. Steve is quite right - I was concentrating on the "competence" test and missed the reference to the operator tax - which you will have already paid in order to gain the privilege of displaying your number on the model.

Edited By Martin Harris on 11/12/2019 18:23:44

Steve J11/12/2019 18:36:23
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Posted by Don Fry on 11/12/2019 18:17:42:

Do the regulations state a absolute master, or a bit more general, under supervision.

As far as I am aware, the regulations are silent on this subject. The buddy box business comes from a BMFA report of a meeting with the CAA.

Don Fry11/12/2019 18:38:21
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Posted by Steve J on 11/12/2019 18:18:26:
Posted by Colin Naylar on 11/12/2019 17:56:19:

If I take a friend to watch and he asks to have a go, does he have to have passed the online test and paid the £9 ?

Test - yes; £9 - no.

**LINK**

Sorry Steve, I followed the link, no reference to what constitutes supervision. I am not being awkward. I live in France, know my regulations, and struggle to actually accept you face such a mountain to teach someone to fly a toy.

Nigel Heather11/12/2019 18:52:09
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Question about the BMFA Competency Test.

 

I have just done it and I selected the option “my aircraft is not fitted with a camera” because it isn’t. I think that as a result of this, my test only comprised 10 questions and the certificate just states section 94 of the ANO.

Wondering now, if later this year I did buy a drone with a camera I may not be legal because my competency certificate just states section 94, not 94 and 95.

So can I take the test again, but this time say that my plane is fitted with a camera so that I get the full certificate?

Many thanks,

 

Nigel

 

Edited By Nigel Heather on 11/12/2019 18:52:43

Edited By Nigel Heather on 11/12/2019 18:57:22

Martin Harris11/12/2019 18:59:30
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I took both tests in order to check them for future reference for students - uploaded both to my profile...next time I looked the standard version had been deleted so I would say the answer is yes - the camera equipped version appears to be seen as an "upgrade".

Steve J11/12/2019 19:00:46
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Posted by Don Fry on 11/12/2019 18:38:21:

no reference to what constitutes supervision. I am not being awkward.

ANO articles 94* and the CAA registration website do not mention training, supervision or person in charge. The ANO says that the remote pilot is the person wiggling the sticks.

The BMFA say that they have discussed training with the CAA and agreed something. I am not aware of anything in writing. I doubt if "Andy says" would cut it with a magistrate.

As I have said before, if I was instructing, the first bit of homework that I would give a trainee would be to do the CAA test.

PS Yes you are.

Edited By Steve J on 11/12/2019 19:01:54

Nigel Heather11/12/2019 19:06:55
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Posted by Martin Harris on 11/12/2019 18:59:30:

I took both tests in order to check them for future reference for students - uploaded both to my profile...next time I looked the standard version had been deleted so I would say the answer is yes - the camera equipped version appears to be seen as an "upgrade".

Presumably we will get Pilot IDs when the BMFA do the bulk upload at the end of January.

If you have uploaded both certificates then I assume the system would be sensible enough to just generate one Pilot ID.

 

Going to do the ‘camera fitted’ one now.

Cheers,

 

Nigel

 

UPDATE - just did it.  Still only asked 10 questions.  They were a mix of section 94 and section 95 questions.

Passed with 10 correct answers, as I did with the ‘no camera fitted’ test.

The two certificates are identical - both state just section 94F, neither mentions section 95.  So it doesn’t seem to matter whether you select ‘no camera fitted’ or ‘camera fitted’ because the competency certificates are identical.

Edited By Nigel Heather on 11/12/2019 19:16:58

Don Fry11/12/2019 19:15:34
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Steve, yes I am.I am old enough, ugly enough to earn the right. But, where, does it say, if I accept responsibility for the flight, the pupil has to pass a test.

Martin Harris11/12/2019 19:18:04
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.

Edited By Martin Harris on 11/12/2019 19:20:16

Martin Harris11/12/2019 19:19:49
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Posted by Nigel Heather on 11/12/2019 19:06:55:

Presumably we will get Pilot IDs when the BMFA do the bulk upload at the end of January.

If you have uploaded both certificates then I assume the system would be sensible enough to just generate one Pilot ID.

I'm sure Steve will correct me if I'm wrong but as a BMFA member you don't need a pilot ID - you are considered competent if you hold an A or B or have passed the RCC test.

CARPERFECT11/12/2019 19:20:06
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From the horses mouth. Andy Symons, came to our Meeting regarding the new Regulations, He told us that While training goes on i.e. Two transmitters, Two people, on buddy lead or wireless, then the person on the slave Tx is neither the operator nor the pilot, So then need nothing as far as the law is concerned. So if Someone asked you for a go, and there is only one tx. They need to have CAA or BMFA certificate. No operator i.d. as that will be on the plane/drone to start with.

Steve J11/12/2019 19:22:45
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Posted by Don Fry on 11/12/2019 19:15:34:

But, where, does it say, if I accept responsibility for the flight, the pupil has to pass a test.

Article 94F.

Is there any sign of the regulations in France being changed to align them with the EU regulations?

Nigel Heather11/12/2019 19:27:21
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Some feedback on the BMFA competency test, having just done both versions

  1. The questions are identical to those sent out with the BMFA magazine.
  2. You are only asked 10 questions
  3. If you select ‘no camera fitted’ then the 10 questions are a random selection from Section 1, questions 1 to 13, the answer options are in a different order than in the list sent out with the magazine, the question includes the question number relating to the set sent out with the magazine
  4. If you select ‘camera fitted’ then the 10 questions are a random selection from sections 1 and 2, questions 1 to 20, the answer options are in the exact order as those in the list sent out with the magazine, the questions do not include the question number relating to the set sent out with the magazine.
  5. The certificate produced is exactly the same whether you do the ‘camera fitted’ or the ‘no camera fitted’ version

Cheers,

Nigel

Edited By Nigel Heather on 11/12/2019 19:31:25

Nigel Heather11/12/2019 19:30:28
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Posted by Martin Harris on 11/12/2019 19:19:49:

Posted by Nigel Heather on 11/12/2019 19:06:55:

Presumably we will get Pilot IDs when the BMFA do the bulk upload at the end of January.

If you have uploaded both certificates then I assume the system would be sensible enough to just generate one Pilot ID.

I'm sure Steve will correct me if I'm wrong but as a BMFA member you don't need a pilot ID - you are considered competent if you hold an A or B or have passed the RCC test.

That makes sense. Explains why you have to carry the competency certificate so you can show that rather than giving plod the pilot ID to look up on the database.

Cheers,

Nigel

CARPERFECT11/12/2019 19:39:41
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Steve J. The Master pilot is always in charge and is the pilot. as he or she is holding the trainer switch, or what ever means there is for the trainer link.

Steve J11/12/2019 19:47:20
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Posted by CARPERFECT on 11/12/2019 19:39:41:

The Master pilot is always in charge and is the pilot. as he or she is holding the trainer switch, or what ever means there is for the trainer link.

Marvellous. Just so I have something to show the constable or magistrate, please can you point me at the ANO article, CAA exemption or CAP that says this?

Don Fry11/12/2019 20:24:57
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Sorry Steve, please be patient, you post of 19.22 hours, article 94F of what?

I have just spent time, and it reckons in French, I am interested in Patent Law. This thread does not give an answer I can find.

re alignment to possible upcoming EASA regulations, I have no idea how France proposes to comply. On a scale of 1 to 10, how important is this in France, it would rate 0.01. My field is used by police dog handlers. They have asked me for a law primer. We parted in peace, I was wished, good flights.

Steve J11/12/2019 20:35:39
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Posted by Don Fry on 11/12/2019 20:24:57:

article 94F of what?

The ANO . The relevant articles are in the annex to CAP 1763.

I have no idea how France proposes to comply. On a scale of 1 to 10, how important is this in France, it would rate 0.01.

Very wise. The French have a sensible attitude to such things unlike our lot who tend to gold plate them.

Don Fry11/12/2019 20:48:03
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Cheers Steve, I'm brain dead now, long day. I will look in the morning.

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