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Flair Puppeteer size

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Rod Parsons 126/11/2019 20:49:01
20 forum posts

Hello

i bought a plan for a Flair Puppeteer, so that I could build one from scratch.

i think it maybe a copy of an original plan.

Could someone please measure the wings on an original plan and see if they are actually 30” each side or just slightly below that , say 29” for instance.

Its not a show stopper, but my plans might be slightly under size. I want to know if the kit built Puppeteer is a full 60” span or slightly under.

Regards

Rod

re

Andy4826/11/2019 21:36:20
1549 forum posts
10 photos

I built a Flair Puppeteer a few years ago, one of the last kits available. Flair didn't give full plans for the plane, mostly diagrams of how the parts all fit together. The plans were for the wings and tail only from memory.

J D 826/11/2019 21:49:24
avatar
1524 forum posts
84 photos

Just measured an upper wing I still have, 60 inch's.

Jon - Laser Engines26/11/2019 21:50:41
5560 forum posts
270 photos

my dad built one 32 years ago and complained that it was 58'' span when built and not 60. Flair told him it was shrinkage of the plans!

Rod Parsons 126/11/2019 22:12:21
20 forum posts

Thanks for the response so far.

I guess my plans are the ‘shrunk’ variety.

Im going to buy the laser cut ribs off e bay ( can’t be bothered cutting them out) and build the rest.

I’ll stretch my wings to be the full 60”.

I need to also transfer actual rib sizes onto the fuselage plans to make the wing cut out match , other wise the bottom wing might not fit on.

I was going to add a bit of length to the nose ( maybe 1” ) to save ballast/ nose weight.

regards

Rod

Trevor Crook26/11/2019 22:29:39
990 forum posts
71 photos

If you are using a Puppeteer cowl it will be worth checking that your fuselage diameter matches it, and "tailoring" if necessary.

Is the cg likely to be a problem? The nose is already longer than a scale Pup, but I've never had one, so I don't know how critical it is. Plenty of help to come from others though, I'm sure!

Another option as you are providing your own wood is to keep the back end as light as possible.

Rod Parsons 126/11/2019 22:43:44
20 forum posts

I saw references to needing nose weight on other threads.

I also plan to split the fus for transport and keep the wings rigged

I might do a build thread.

Ive been trying to join this site for 10 years plus and always get locked out during setting up, contact administrator, etc, then complete lock down.

I tried tonight ( first time in about 5 years ) and got straight on.

Good- I’ve got some Flair Stearman build questions I can ask.

Rod

Geoff S27/11/2019 00:48:41
3700 forum posts
29 photos

When I worked for RR the only blueprint type drawings I ever had any contact with (that's when we actually had prints made) were always circuit diagrams but somewhere there was always the notice 'Do Not Scale'. That was of no account to me but it acknowledged that drawings on paper are not dimensionally stable and therefore you should only take acount of the dimension written on the drawing and not try to scale or measure the drawing itself with a ruler.

Of course, as aeromodellers, we ignore that problem and use drawings as a jig and build over them hence wing spans are often not as quoted. The DB Pup I'm building has CNC cut ribs and didn't actually match the chord of the drawing exactly but it didn't really affect the build. However, I think the span came out about right at 60".

Geoff

cymaz27/11/2019 06:12:08
avatar
9283 forum posts
1200 photos

I have a brand new cowl for a Flair Pupp and a box of old bits. A few £ s for the cowl plus p&p and I’ll see what else there is in the box.

will post a photo soon if you want it

Jon - Laser Engines27/11/2019 08:59:00
5560 forum posts
270 photos

Dont bother making the nose longer. Its already longer than scale and it will start to look strange if you make it longer still.

I have flown 3 of these now and they were all lovely after some tweaking. My Dads model used a 50 4 stroke and had about 1lb of lead bolted to the firewall. Even so, it was light as a butterfly and flew brilliantly so just add the lead and forget about it. Note that he balanced his forward of the marks on the plan as he thought it flew better. Having flown another 2 balanced as the plan i would agree it needs more ballast and upon adding this weight to a friends model it flew much better. Again this model was 50 4 stroke powered.

When it comes to power, they have flown on engines as small as a 25 2 stroke so dont go mad. You certainly dont need a 70 4 stroke and from my experience a 50 is more than enough.

I also wouldnt get crazy about adding the 2 inches back either to the wings. It will make next to no difference to the model and will only create more work.

If you want to create more work, forget the wings/nose and instead make a taller undercarriage and have it sprung like the full size. It wont improve the flying or ground handling, but it will make it look much more scale

cymaz27/11/2019 16:35:04
avatar
9283 forum posts
1200 photos

PM me if you want the bits

1e4dc885-5a3d-4a6a-bb84-677aa21cca9a.jpeg

the cowl is 172mm wide,100mm opening, 63mm deep

Geoff S27/11/2019 17:00:46
3700 forum posts
29 photos

If I were buildiing another I'd do something about the real bind when assembling at the field - fitting the 8 nuts and bolts needed for the 4 interplane struts. Look at the simple method worked out by Boddo for the 58" Moths (Tiger and Cirrus) using split cotter eyes, a long through pin and an elastic band. I think it's described on the DB S&S site.

I have both Moths (the system may also be used on other DB biplanes but my experience is with the Moths) and field assemby/dissembly is very quick and easy. The same method is used on the 60" DB Pup I'm building.

It might also be worth fitting a plywood platform on the cabanes and fitting the top wing to that with wooden hooks and a couple of bolts screwed in from the top also as DB do. Grovelling around peering underneath to fit the 4 bolts that secure the top wing is also a sure way of consigning the Puppeteer to hangar queen status after the flush of enthusiasm as worn thin.

Geoff

Andy4827/11/2019 17:11:00
1549 forum posts
10 photos

I split my pup behind the cockpit. Two bolts and two servo leads to join and job done in a minute.

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