|Jon - Laser Engines||28/01/2020 08:33:16|
|5621 forum posts|
This entire thread seems to be turning into a confirmation bias laden love letter to software. Some of the statements are just simply wrong.
Windows is perfectly secure if you arent an idiot about it. I also dont see all these stability/compatibility problems that keep getting mentioned either. Dealing with about 8 W10 systems on a more or less daily basis i really dont understand where all the problems are coming from. Even my parents, who were able to destroy windows 7 pc's almost weekly by installing everything web page popups told them to, have kept theirs running for 2 years without a hitch. Windows can have a meltdown just like any piece of software and i get far more irritated with problems on my android devices than my windows ones.
Linux absolutely has its place but as i have said before, this thread was aimed at the technophobe. They are not going to be running command line stuff and verifying download integrity.
|Alex Ferguson 2||28/01/2020 08:42:38|
55 forum posts
Who runs command line stuff? Certainly none of the users I deal with.
A year of Win10 crashing, losing drivers every month. Why do you think I don't like it? It really depended where you were in the priority list for updates. If unfortunate and at the front of the queue you got trashed. This from a commercial outfit - just not professional. It never happens with our Linux installations.
|Peter Christy||28/01/2020 09:25:13|
|1874 forum posts|
When I read through the posts here, I see a lot of years out-of-date misconceptions about Linux - just as most members of the public still regard model aeroplanes as "noisy, smelly things" - even when they are gliders!
Firstly, you don't *have* to carry out integrity checks on your downloaded installation files. You can just run them. But then you won't know if they've been compromised or not, just as you never know if a windows install file has been compromised or not.
Linux offers you the option. Whether you take advantage of it or not is up to you.
Secondly, Linux is a compartmemtalised system. It was designed as a multi-user, network system right from the start. Windows was originally designed as a standalone, single user system and had networking grafted on to it as an afterthought (using the TCP/IP stack from Unix, BTW - Linux' first cousin!)
Because of this compartmentalisation - each user has their own, separate workspace - if one user is careless, it won't compromise the other users on the system, or the core operating system itself. Again, this is unlike windows. To use an analogy, not since the Titanic have shipbuilders built ships that aren't split into discrete, watertight sections, so that one getting flooded doesn't compromise the whole ship.
Thirdly, while there are viruses out there that can attack Linux systems, they are few and far between, and even if one gets to your machine (highly unlikely), it can only do limited damage. There is very little anti-virus software available for Linux, because it isn't that necessary! (The best and most common one, if you really feel the need, is free and open-source, just like the operating system.)
Fourthly, kiss goodbye to de-fragging and cleaning disk drives every week or two. I know windows 10 does this (supposedly) in the background, but it still involves a lot of disk thrashing and slows the system down. Not needed on Linux.
I could go on and on, but really, the only reason windows still sells is because people have been brainwashed into believing that it is the only decent operating system out there.
It was a total kludge was it first appeared, and although a lot of its major flaws have been disguised, it remains hog-tied and bloated due to its need to be backwards compatible almost to its DOS origins.
Like castor oil, its time it was put out to grass!
Tony: Yes, Geoff and I keep looking at the weather to see when we can get out and prepare the field again. At present, its like a swamp! (OK, probably a frozen swamp this morning!) However, if we get a half decent day, we could probably take your Bixler up to the golf club site? Its a bit of a walk from the car park, but probably the best bet at present!
|Jon - Laser Engines||28/01/2020 09:50:10|
|5621 forum posts|
You mean like defragging every week? Crashing every week and loosing drivers?
|Peter Christy||28/01/2020 10:05:17|
|1874 forum posts|
Just because the user isn't de-fragging, doesn't mean it isn't happening. The latest iterations of windows do it in the background. However, it is still being done - the filing systems haven't changed, due to the backward compatibility issues I alluded to - and this causes a huge performance hit when it occurs.
I keep a windows 10 partition on one machine here, though it rarely gets used. On the occasions I fire it up, although it appears to boot quickly, it then spends nearly 10 minutes "disk thrashing" before it becomes usable. Same machine with Linux boots in under a minute (biggest hold up is the BIOS, common to windows and linux) and is usable as soon as the screen appears, and NO disk thrashing!
Life is too short!
|Jon - Laser Engines||28/01/2020 10:17:31|
|5621 forum posts|
Windows 10 does talk to the hard drive quite a bit, which is why you boot from an SSD and not a hard drive. A system i built recently with a £15 SSD boots from button click to desktop in about 8 seconds, with 5 of them being BIOS. My gaming system takes a bit longer, perhaps 20 seconds, but i have shed loads of monitoring and game related things to load when it starts up.
That said, i recently discovered that W10 seems to work much faster on 2.5'' hard disks than the larger 3.5's. I assume the smaller platter size has an impact on seek times. Not sure, but it was interesting running the same system on the same cloned OS on the two different drives and noticing the difference.
Not that it matters that much as i dont know why anyone would use a mechanical drive for anything other than mass storage. Even my laptop with its slow (relatively) eMMC flash based hard drive gets on with its life without any slowdown gets on with its life.
In any case, you cant hold the software responsible for slow and outdated hardware
Edited By Jon - Laser Engines on 28/01/2020 10:20:51
|Andy Meade||28/01/2020 10:26:23|
2784 forum posts
In fact defragging SSD's is a Very Bad Idea. You're right on life being too short - all of my Win 10 boxes boot in under 10 seconds!
Last time I tried a *nix variant, it couldn't find drivers for a PCI-E wifi card, nor were the graphics card drivers able to be updated to enable the latest features. It's a nice little gimmick to have and boast that your OS is free, but I don't mind paying for quality and ease of use.
I've used Windows boxes since 3.11, and used it professionally day-in and day-out for 25 years in all it's different flavours. Guess how many viruses of caught? None. I always find that those susceptible to them are rather too click-happy, and rarely check sources of emails or veracity of sites visited.
I'll stick with the market leader
|Peter Christy||28/01/2020 11:43:21|
|1874 forum posts||
You can when the same machine is infinitely faster on the alternative!
And yes, you are right about SSDs, and I do use them on both my main machine and my wife's. My laptop is stuck with spinning rust at the moment, because I need lots of storage on it (video editing/storage while traveling) and a similar size SSD is too expensive at present (but falling in price rapidly, so maybe an update soon!).
However, for those who really insist on using an old fashioned and clunky system ( ) for heaven's sake don't pay PC World prices! I see they currently charge £165 for windows 10 pro!!!
do exactly the same (LEGAL copy) for £20! And occasionally they have a sale and do it for even less!
Its where I got my copy from, and no issues - other than the usual micro$oft ones!
|Jon - Laser Engines||28/01/2020 12:28:36|
|5621 forum posts|
To be fair you should just say 'avoid pc world' for pretty much anything computer related. Their prices are imaginative at best.
As for W10, just use the windows 7 licence key that is stuck on the side of the computer you already have
On the SSD/HDD thing my media pc has all of the my dvd's copied to it and they live on a big old 4tb HDD. The system boots from a 120gb SSD though so everything is nice and speedy
423 forum posts
I hope that you computer techies forgive me, what started off as information for helping out a windows 7 problem seems to have ended up as a quantum physic's session to me, and perhaps a couple of others. I am now at a loss what to do, my W7 is performing as before, does what I ask, lets me fiddle about with my Phoenix, and do my emails. My concern was about the security after windows said it will not be supported so I wonder if my option was to upgrade this to 10, Jon kindly pointed out it is a bit dated and would recommend a linked new laptop which was the option I was going for, then Linux reared up, I fear far too technical for me, then Kaspersky came into play, shall I put this on this laptop, decisions, decisions, decisions. I shall probably go for the new one, then possibly try the upgrade on this one. Do I have to copy everything I have on here or will it remain on here during and after the upgrade.
Keep it simple please chaps, I know you are all being helpful but my eyes spin at some of the technical posts, probably born 40 years too early.
Edited By fly-navy on 28/01/2020 23:48:35
|john stones 1||29/01/2020 00:21:04|
11646 forum posts
Well I'm a P.C numpty, no idea what they're on about, but enjoying it.
They've a way to go before they match the drone threads though.
|Alex Ferguson 2||29/01/2020 06:17:30|
55 forum posts
Microsoft wants your money so they say "End of Life" EOL. It is actually "End of Support" EOS a totally different thing. Your Win7 will keep going as long as the computer continues to work.
If you only read emails and minimal web browsing a free virus checker such as Avast should be all that is needed if needed at all and stay with Win7. Your computer does all you want it to? Then stay with it.
As for age, a suspect I might have been working on computers and such while you were "still in short pants" as they say.
Phoenix? Phoenix computer game, Phoenix RC planes supplier ???
As for copying files from computer to computer, I use a programme called Dukto. It works on everything (Windows, Apple, Linux, Android) and is very simple. Once installed and agreed to terms and conditions (what ever they are???)(click), with it booted up on both computers, each should see the other providing they are both connected to the same router, via wire or WiFi. You could use an old modem/router and not even connect to the outside world.
The computer the files are going from, click on the bottom box which should have the name of the computer files are to go to.
Drag files or folders across to the box and drop them in and wait. It might take some time, a few GB will definitely take time but a bar shows how progress is going.
With Windows they should appear on the desktop of the receiving computer. Then move them to where you actually want them.
Edited By Alex Ferguson 2 on 29/01/2020 06:18:51
751 forum posts
Yes, I use Dukto as well, and agree it is brilliant, BUT from their website:-
UPDATE: this project is no longer maintained. You can download it and use it if it works on your devices, but I can’t provide any update and support anymore. I won’t provide also any security or bugfix update.
I will continue to use it as long as it keeps working, but perhaps not for "sensitive" data.
|ken anderson.||29/01/2020 13:37:32|
8752 forum posts
|john stones 1||29/01/2020 14:52:10|
11646 forum posts
Humerous poll, can we do humerous ? Sounds good to me Ken.
To stay on topic I'm still on Windows 7, terrified of computers.
|Gary Manuel||29/01/2020 15:46:30|
2292 forum posts
My main computer and my laptop are on Win7 Pro and that's where they're staying.
Laptop used for nestbox CCTV is on XP + POSReady and that's staying where it's staying.
Son's gaming computer is on Win 10. I hate it even though I've installed "Classic Shell" on it to make it look like older versions. He likes it though and it goes like a rocket (should do for what I paid for it).
335 forum posts
Right gents, this could be a long one so make yourself comfortable, and use this as bedtime reading.
Firstly, my thanks to the OP for starting this thread - it has spurred me on to do something about my computer.
I have been on Win7 Pro now for 8-9yrs with no problems and was adamant I was not going to change. Now that support has been stopped it's got me concerned. I have been doing some research these past two weeks and found many who detest Win10 and wish they still had Win7, but because of security I have come to the decision to 'bite the bullet' and relent.
Reading Gary's post above has got me thinking again.. Is there a way around this?
An IT expert informs me that even with a paid Kaspersky anti-virus I'm still leaving myself open to threats. BTW free Avast sell your data. I've read that Win7 is going to be alright for the next 6mths or so as long as you don't go onto dodgy sites. I've only had a few red flag warning come up over the years. Last one was from a Google search page advert banner for Adidas trainers that were much cheaper than elsewhere. Also some high-end ludicrously cheap rc products from the Far East.
My laptop is a high-spec Sony which I paid a lot of money for. Most people would consider it 'old' but it does everything I need and I have no wish to get a new one - even if it was offered free! Only thing I've done was upgrade to 8GB RAM. It has developed a couple of problems now. Firstly, it overheats and shuts down frequently. This is because of dust build-up on the fan. It is easily fixed by opening it up, vacuuming and using compressed air. I have done it once before and it make a big difference. Second problem is sometimes when I close the lid and open it up I get a black screen. The computer is on but cannot get the screen working so I have to remove the battery and boot up again. It's probably a loose connection to the lid, so will have to seen by a professional.
As I am going to Win10 I have decided to replace the old drive to Solid State Drive. I have everything I need now to do the major overhaul. SSD, USB/SATA lead, compressed air, MX-2 Thermal Compound and new battery. The thermal paste is essential for heat transfer from CPU and GPU to the cooling pipes. There's a whole science behind that.. the tech geeks and gamers on youtube help with that.
So, initially, I wanted to do a 'clean install' without any 'bloatware' - but transferring files over was going to be a pain - a task I don't want to undertake. I don't want to loose anything - I want everything working as it is. My laptop is fast enough as it is. So, it's going to have to be a copy and then I'll just trim down Win10 as much as I can. Win10 runs slower than Win7. I will have the Pro version so I can control the 'updates'. Windows do two major updates a year that's when things can go wrong. I'd rather defer them for a couple of months till they get the bugs sorted out.
At the end of the day it's all about 'Control'- I hate any machine having total control. My pet hate is seat belt warning alarms. Glad my car doesn't have it, otherwise I'd be cutting wires!
For me, my computer is just a tool, a very useful one beit.. I've realised my files/folders are quite disorganised. I'm going to have to devote some time and learn how to file properly and make it a habit. Another chore.
Also, Disable Cortana. She listens in and reports everything back to HQ.
Linus Mint was suggested to me and offered on a memory stick. I'll download it for a later date maybe. Also, you can run Win7 as VM (virtual memory) within Linus - way beyond my skills at the moment.
My problem is I have such little patience with computers.. unlike my RC gear. I'm not IT savvy and would not dare mess about with 'registry' and such but I've come to realise I'm not overwhelmed with much of it. It's just tedious and time consuming.
Wish me luck.
|Low pass Pete||31/01/2020 06:35:07|
265 forum posts
Just to add my 2p worth. I have been running Windows 7 since 2011 or so on an Acer laptop. Had no issues so avoided the free Window 10 upgrade from Microsoft.
Now I am a firm believer that there is no such thing as a free lunch. However security is important to me, so on hearing about the demise of W7 I had some soul searching to do. Upgrade or go for a new set up.
My old laptop was running ok so an upgrade seemed a simple way to go...….Finally bought a new HP laptop with SSD and an I5 processor but less storage than I had in my old laptop (which I never used fully anyway). Yes I have spent money. However I was having battery life issues with the old set up.
BIG gain is speed. Switch on and hardly any wait at all. Boot up speed is great, and so much of an improvement. New laptop is lighter, but it remains to be seen if it lasts as long as the Acer.
No Phaff and now I am using the laptop so much more, simply because it is quick. Not quite a fast as using my Phone but you can do a lot more on a laptop especially if you need to use Excell which I do.
All the best
|Peter Jenkins||31/01/2020 23:44:23|
|1644 forum posts|
I have to say that Win 10 is proving to be significantly faster on boot up than Win 7 on the same hardware. The difference between the two is pretty small - at least so far - and so I'm happy I took the leap into upgrading Win 10 for free!
335 forum posts
Hello Peter, glad to know your free upgrade went well.
The difference in speed you see is because of the new SSD. They run up to x5 faster than the old HDD's.
Do remember to uncheck and disable as much as you can - like Cortana and updates. 'britec' on youtube explains it well.
I'm staying with Win7 for now and looking into Linux.
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