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Westwings Fournier RF4 missing/damaged formers

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Harry Wright 128/01/2020 22:20:20
6 forum posts

Hi all,

New here, and new to kit making in general - I have started building a Westwings Fournier RF4 (stand off scale originally built for 400 size motor). Kit was bought second hand.

Went to start fuselage construction and realised that several of the formers are missing or damaged beyond repair (F6 and F7).

The formers are not represented on the main plans, otherwise I could easily trace and make my own replacements. I have attempted, so far unsuccessfully, to make my own replacements.

I was hoping someone with more experience, or who had this kit lying about might be able to help me?

A digital image (possibly scanned?) of the original formers would be ideal!

Thanks in advance, and please forgive my ignorance..

Martian29/01/2020 11:59:26
2579 forum posts
1170 photos

Welcome Harry, try contacting Westwings they are usually very helpful

paul d29/01/2020 13:40:44
208 forum posts
26 photos

Think you'll find westwings shut down ages ago?

Martian29/01/2020 14:09:10
2579 forum posts
1170 photos

Ah that explains why I couldn't find anything . Harry persevere with making the formers use cardboard until you get the shape then make them from balsa . I made the WW rf4 with only the kit plans i don't know whether I kept the templates but will check

Harry Wright 130/01/2020 08:33:28
6 forum posts

Hi all, thank you for the replies.

Thanks for the cardboard tip, I'll have another crack at it this evening. If you manage to find the templates then please do let me know!

Christopher Long 130/01/2020 08:54:15
48 forum posts
3 photos

I understand that Westwings kits have been licensed for production by the Vintage Model Company and are due to be phased in starting in the first half of this year.

Harry Wright 130/01/2020 14:59:27
6 forum posts

Hi Christopher,

Thanks for the heads up, I sent an email to Vintage Model Company and had the following reply -

We are working on producing a number of Westwings planes and the Fournier RF4 is in the second batch. My colleague is still working on producing drawings and cut files and has begun to do the RF4. I will let you know when we are in a postition to cut the parts, or send you an accurate parts sheet

Looking to purchase servos and receiver, can anyone recommend a particular set? Mine is the earlier 3 function Fournier.

Cheers

Alan Gorham_30/01/2020 15:17:29
avatar
1320 forum posts
146 photos

Harry do you happen to have the waste balsa sheets that the formers came out of? I guess not from what you have said, but if you do have them, then they will have the outline shapes of the parts that you can trace out to make new parts....

Regarding radio, I seem to remember the plan shows mini sized servos in the fuselage and I fitted Hitec Hs-101 servos to mine (built in 1996!). There is limited space for the Receiver so I would suggest looking for a small full range Rx that is compatible with your transmitter.

Radio requirements are very non-critical so use your favourite brand.

How experienced a flier are you? The Rudder/elevator version of this model is a tricky beast to fly. It really needs more dihedral to help rudder response, or to be flown fast at all times.

I learnt the quirks of mine, but many years later modified it to have ailerons with micro servos fitted in the wings. Much better.

Harry Wright 131/01/2020 10:05:58
6 forum posts

Hi Alan,

I don't have the old sheets unfortunately..However, Vintage Model Company have said they will supply the damage/missing formers for a couple of quid.

Thanks for advice re servos and radio. I'm certainly not what you would call an experienced flier, so am of the mind to spare myself the pain later on and adapt the wings for ailerons before I finish them.

Progress has been slow recently, but won't be long before fuselage is completed. I'll aim to upload some photos at some point. I've had to make a few adaptations to the nose in order to accommodate the brushless motor.

Alan Gorham_31/01/2020 10:19:09
avatar
1320 forum posts
146 photos

Good news regarding the formers then!

Another thing to be wary of. Even with ailerons, this model likes to tip stall. The instructions tell you to twist washout into the wings when covering them. Great idea - you do need washout with such a long, tapered wing.

This did not work on my model as over time the covering film relaxed and the washout disappeared. Much better to build the washout into the wings by using webbing between the spars - which the plan doesn't show.

Harry Wright 131/01/2020 17:41:33
6 forum posts

Hi Alan,

My understanding of 'washout' is fairly limited, but that twisting the wing tips downward can achieve this?

Does anyone have photos demonstrating how this can be built into a wing using webbing as Alan describes?

Thanks

Alan Gorham_31/01/2020 18:28:38
avatar
1320 forum posts
146 photos

The trailing edge of the wing tip should twist upwards with relation to the wing root for washout. If you twisted it down it would give wash in which is the opposite of what's needed.

The theory is that washout gives the tips a lower angle of attack than the roots meaning the wing root stalls first.

I haven't any pictures of my build but if you Google something like built up wing washout and look at images in the search results you might get some ideas.

The basic theory is that as you go along building your wing and pinning it to the building board, you slide a removable packing strip under the trailing edge of the wing that is wedge shaped. The thick edge of the wedge goes to the tip of the wing. This will introduce the twist into the wing so long as the rest of the wing panel remains pinned to the building board. Once this assembly has set, you add the webbing between the upper and lower spars (webbing uses vertical grain wood to resist the bending of the spars. The webbing will lock in any twist.

Phill Harrison03/02/2020 21:04:07
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2 forum posts

Hey ya guys..this the first post for me on here ..so allo from New Zealand..I noticed this post because I just brought a WW RF4 off a auction site here called trademe...I brought it for a $150 NZ..about 75 pounds...now this is the part I think you blokes will like..what I got for my coins..the plane of course..one flight..one crash..now the goodies..now these are all brand new parts...an OS 3805-1200 motor..Futaba T6K T-FHSS trans..4x Savox Sh-0255 digital servos..GT Power SD4 charger..Hobbyking Platinum pro 40a ESC .7.4v 3000 mAh Lipo and a covering iron..over $1000 NZ here for that lot..now here's the list of why it crashed and it's pretty bad...the planes motor was glued to the fire wall..the hinges for all flaps were brass jewelry box hinges..stiff as hell...no CG at all ..the ailerons were not mixed and the servos controlling them were not mounted straight..this poor bird was never going to stay up built like that..this guy thought he knew it all or guessed pretty badly..either way I'm chuffed to bits with this.

Cheers

Phill

Harry Wright 109/02/2020 11:02:08
6 forum posts

Hi Phill,

Sounds like you grabbed a bargain, but also have a lot of work to do!

I'd be interested to know how you get on with the modifications.

Is your model the older version like mine, or the later kit with aileron modification?

I also have a question re motor down thrust for anyone who has built the RF4. My older kit plan doesn't appear to require down thrust, whereas the new plan which I acquired from Vintage Model Company does indeed seem to require about degrees of down thrust. Would the older version not have required built in down thrust due to weight of the old fashioned 400 motor? I'm adapting my front end to accommodate a brushless motor which will of course be a fair bit lighter. All thoughts/comments welcome!

Alan Gorham_09/02/2020 11:47:02
avatar
1320 forum posts
146 photos

Down thrust is not used to offset the weight of a nose mounted powerplant. Indeed it couldn't have any effect. It may well be that either the wing/tail incidences have been modified or more likely that modern power systems will be able to deliver more power and will cause the model to climb steeply under power.

I enjoyed the story of the model that wouldn't fly due to "no CG at all". Yes, if you forget to fit the CG you are on a hiding to nothing.

Phill Harrison11/02/2020 22:01:42
avatar
2 forum posts

Hey Harry. .to be honest with you mate I haven't the slightest idea what version mine is...what I can tell you is that fitting hinges to the ailerons has made a world of difference ..ten times smoother and the react much faster now too.

Now yes a bargain I did get until I tested all the servos.. receiver and the like...guess what ?..because Mr Wally glued the receiver to one of the spars in the fuselage No2 port not working very well at all..checked the servo with my Hi-tech system and nope not that..so now to spend $135 NZ on new one..still I'm not complaing ..it's still a wicked deal 😁

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