By continuing to use this site, you agree to our use of cookies. Find out more
Forum sponsored by:
Forum sponsored by CML

Ben Buckle kits.

All Topics | Latest Posts

Search for:  in Thread Title in  
Richard Clark 219/07/2020 11:27:29
424 forum posts
Posted by David Davis on 19/07/2020 07:14:15:

I'd just like to endorse Broken English's remarks about building light.

A couple of months ago I lost my thirty-two year old Junior 60 built fom a Flair kit. It was my first successful radio controlled model aeroplane. We appeared to have no control when it glided into a wheat field behind two hedges on the other side of a road, and though it was finished over all in orange, we could not find it. I say that it was thirty-two years old but it was like Trigger's broom, it was on its second fuselage and third tailplane!

In its first manifestation the fuselage was covered in Olive Drab parachute nylon and the wings and tail surfaces in Natural Solartex. It was powered by a converted Irvine 20 car racing engine. By mistake I had used the hardest wood in the kit for the tailplane and it required one and a half pounds of lead in the nose to balance correctly. It still flew.

I built a new tailplane for it and was able to remove all of the lead from the nose. This proved to be too weak so I built a third. Over the years I fitted a number of engines including a PAW 19, an HPVT 20 which usually required a hand launch and an HPVT25 which didn't. I like the sound of four strokes even if they're not period but when the model was lost it was fitted with an electric motor.

I feel the need to build another Junior 60 because there are a lot of retired beginners in my club and the Junior 60 was ideal for giving them their first experience of radio controlled flight. Unfortunately I already have two models in build and another, a Chris Olsen Uproar, in need of half a wing, but one of the two models on the stocks is a double sized Tomboy. Maybe that will take over the role of the primary trainer. If I do build another Junior 60 it will be covered in Solartex because I have considerable stocks of this material. To me, vintage models covered in film, even transparent film which shows off the structure, do not look right though I realise that this is a popular way of covering vintage models in the USA.

Each to his own.

junior 60 in flight.jpg

Edited By David Davis on 19/07/2020 07:14:57

I think we would all agree about building light.

But getting the C of G in the right place is not the same thing.

Sure, building light in the tail area will help to do both. But replacing any of the wood in a kit and/or altering the design partially negates the purpose in buying a kit at all.

Also covering in doped nylon or Solartex is NOT building light.

Two opposing examples of my building:

TopFlitw kit 63 inch Spitfire OS 81 - ten pounds. (TopFlite's own model was slightly heavier.)

Similar size/engine Prettner Curare from RCM&E plan but structure somewhat altered by me - five and a half pounds.

David Davis19/07/2020 12:21:33
avatar
3866 forum posts
741 photos

"... Also covering in doped nylon or Solartex is NOT building light. ..."

Agreed, but they are both very tough coverings and and ideal for the treatment which I meeted out to it when I was a novice or indeed the treatment it received at the hands of my current crop of trainees. They were all amazed at how slowly it flew and how easy it was to fly once they'd stopped putting in inputs which were too coarse.

I will have the opportunity to report on a Ben Buckle kit in September. My partner is coming over and she is keen to be involved in the building of a Super 60. I expect that we'll cover it in Solartex. She's learning to fly too. She's already a whizz on the simulator!

Richard Clark 219/07/2020 12:59:21
424 forum posts
II'vePosted by David Davis on 19/07/2020 12:21:33:

"... Also covering in doped nylon or Solartex is NOT building light. ..."

 

Agreed, but they are both very tough coverings and and ideal for the treatment which I meeted out to it when I was a novice or indeed the treatment it received at the hands of my current crop of trainees. They were all amazed at how slowly it flew and how easy it was to fly once they'd stopped putting in inputs which were too coarse.

I will have the opportunity to report on a Ben Buckle kit in September. My partner is coming over and she is keen to be involved in the building of a Super 60. I expect that we'll cover it in Solartex. She's learning to fly too. She's already a whizz on the simulator!

I've got some of the similar Oratex but have not yet used it. I think both it and Solartex are a bit heavy for such sized planes. Bur then I don't use them as trainers as though an experienced and 'adequate' flyer I do not feel confident to train people.

And unlike you I very much like the coloured transparent film on vintage models as though it is not authentic I think they look 'pretty'. So much so that I almost covered my recently built Mercury Aeronca Sedan with it. But then I came to my senses and used Oracover solid colours

As for my Curare I was on a particularly 'low weight' kick when I built it. But it can get complicated, with tapered wing spars, 'girder' type built up ribs, and so on and I'm not sure it's worth the effort.

PS: Your Junior 60 looks lovely. You have captured the 'atmosphere' of the original. Many people don't achieve that.

Edited By Richard Clark 2 on 19/07/2020 13:04:29

bees30/07/2020 19:30:14
157 forum posts

Finally maidened the Playboy Senior this afternoon. Did not have high expectations because i must have had half a church roof to get the reccomened CG.How ever to my amazement it took of rather sluggish but gained height then i cut the motor to see how it was at gliding.It would glide but would lose height very quickly and seeing how people have said that it would stay up forever i was rather disappointed to say the least.Anyway i landed and took some lead off and tried again and although it was better it was not brilliant so landed again. This time i took all the lead off that was left and thought bugger it and went for it with out checking the CG. This time with less weight take off was a lot faster and after gaining some height cut the motor and low and behold she flew great with hardly any drop in height Yahoo this is what i was hoping for. Did not have time for another flight so came home a happy chap.

Andy Joyce26/11/2020 18:36:59
avatar
426 forum posts
69 photos

Well had a Playboy Senior on order from BB but just had the money refunded as the site owner has health problems at the moment.

Looking on other kit sites the KK Southerner looks very nice and I assume it would accommodate the SC 30FS I had purchased for the Playboy.

Would welcome any other suggestions for a vintage design around a wing span of 70 inches and upward.

Jim Carss26/11/2020 19:06:38
avatar
2170 forum posts
85 photos

AJ

hows about these two,both scaled down to 60" span by Derick Scott.

Eros and KK Falcon,iam busy with the Eros at present,both for SC30 FS power.

eros.jpg

img_0006.jpg

Link to model plans in next post

Jim Carss26/11/2020 19:08:12
avatar
2170 forum posts
85 photos

AJ

**LINK**

kc26/11/2020 19:58:52
6955 forum posts
175 photos

Andy, did BB give any idea whether this is just a very temporary situation?

Various sizes of Playboy Senior plans here on Outerzone. I noticed that SLEC and Balsa Cabin had balsa stripwood available recently even though they did not have balsa sheet.

There was quite a lot of discussion recently about The Answer and similar design Super Scorpion, more complex building but the Scorpion or Super Scorpion appealed a lot to me. Again the plans are free on Outerzone

Andy Joyce27/11/2020 09:09:14
avatar
426 forum posts
69 photos
Posted by kc on 26/11/2020 19:58:52:

Andy, did BB give any idea whether this is just a very temporary situation?

Various sizes of Playboy Senior plans here on Outerzone. I noticed that SLEC and Balsa Cabin had balsa stripwood available recently even though they did not have balsa sheet.

There was quite a lot of discussion recently about The Answer and similar design Super Scorpion, more complex building but the Scorpion or Super Scorpion appealed a lot to me. Again the plans are free on Outerzone

Re BB; Afraid I was not given a date, but the lady who looks after the admin did say she would contact me when manufacture of their products re-starts.

Do like the look of some of the larger wing span designs on the Belair site such as the Scram 1.3, but concerned I would not be able to get a 107" wing into my car.

Hope by the time I get my new workshop up and running allowing me to build a vintage design this shortage of balsa will not be an issue.

Had a ground breaking ceremony yesterday with the shuttering for the workshop base being installed, so now waiting for the workmen to return with several large buckets of concrete. Wife is not impressed as the garden is a complete mess!

Andy Joyce27/11/2020 09:37:19
avatar
426 forum posts
69 photos
Posted by David Davis on 19/07/2020 12:21:33:

"... Also covering in doped nylon or Solartex is NOT building light. ..."

Agreed, but they are both very tough coverings and and ideal for the treatment which I meeted out to it when I was a novice or indeed the treatment it received at the hands of my current crop of trainees. They were all amazed at how slowly it flew and how easy it was to fly once they'd stopped putting in inputs which were too coarse.

I will have the opportunity to report on a Ben Buckle kit in September. My partner is coming over and she is keen to be involved in the building of a Super 60. I expect that we'll cover it in Solartex. She's learning to fly too. She's already a whizz on the simulator!

Used to build and fly Super 60's in the early 70's. Construction was never aimed at being lite as all the open structure on the fuselage was covered in 1/16 balsa and a considerable amount of ply went into the wing as this was a second weak point of the original design. Engine used was a second hand Merco 61 which still runs, but now leaks more fuel from the front bearing than it burns. Last Super 60 I had went into the bin in 1991 as thought the years of storage would have dried out the balsa and at that time I had other interests only coming back to the hobby in the last 10 years. Shame as sure it would still be a good flyer.

David Davis 227/11/2020 10:12:31
avatar
48 forum posts
26 photos

I have just about finished building a Super 60 with my partner Trish, also known as Miss Blue Eyes.

miss blue eyes gets on with it.jpg

 

This will be the third which I've owned. I was once given a fuselage so bought a plan from Colin Buckle at the Three Counties Showground and finished the build, then I bought a Penn Models Super 60 on eBay from a bloke in Wolverhampton, but this one will be for electric power. I am waiting for my transmitter to come back from the menders then I'll rig up the closed loop to the rudder.

nearly there.jpg

It's not the best model I've ever built. I'm not 100% happy with the windscreen and I wish I'd rigged the elevator pushrod to come out centrally at the fuselage. It would have been more efficacious and it would have looked neater. I suppose I could change those in the future if I wanted to.

Edited By David Davis 2 on 27/11/2020 10:18:56

kc27/11/2020 10:58:43
6955 forum posts
175 photos

Re Ben Buckle Kits. I expect the shortage of balsa also affects production re-start.

Andy, when you get any info that production is starting would you please let the forum know.

Andy Joyce27/11/2020 11:17:21
avatar
426 forum posts
69 photos
Posted by kc on 27/11/2020 10:58:43:

Re Ben Buckle Kits. I expect the shortage of balsa also affects production re-start.

Andy, when you get any info that production is starting would you please let the forum know.

Will do.

Andy Joyce27/11/2020 11:30:56
avatar
426 forum posts
69 photos

Nice to see the old designs still in manufacture. All my constructions of the Super 60 used nylon and shrinking dope then lots of humbrol enamel to act as a fuel proofer.

One trick I recall was to fiberglass the engine bay and underneath the fuel tank as the Merco 61 used to leak a lot of castor oil.

Lights were also installed on the wings for night flying which was very popular in our club in the 70's.

David Ashby - Moderator27/11/2020 14:55:29
avatar
Moderator
11232 forum posts
1777 photos
624 articles

I've had a message to the effect that Colin of BB is just undergoing rehab after surgery and, hopefully, should be back at the helm in a couple of weeks. Like lots of Hobby traders, he's the owner/manager which is why things have been a little quiet of late.

Engine Doctor27/11/2020 15:18:14
avatar
2724 forum posts
44 photos
Posted by Jim Carss on 26/11/2020 19:06:38:

AJ

hows about these two,both scaled down to 60" span by Derick Scott.

Eros and KK Falcon,iam busy with the Eros at present,both for SC30 FS power.

eros.jpg

Nice looking model Jim

I built a scaled down Eros a few years ago ,pic below, from a kit produced by one of our club members .All laser cut and perfect fits . He did the design and Slec did the cutting etc. Brilliant . A clever so and so.

The Eros is a beautiful looking model and mine a 50 inch version was designed to take an ED Hornet 1.46 cc diesel. It flew OK but not as nicely as it looked possibly due to the tail plane being high up and out of the prop wash . Rudder authority was good but elevator was poor unless flying fast.

eros vintage model 001.jpg

eros vintage model 002.jpg

eros pics 001 (1).jpg

The eagle eyed will notice that the tail fin has a different profile made wider to increase effect for radio use . I did this after testing the model built by the kit maker as the rudder authority was poor.

It was covered in Lightspan and sprayed with a cream mixed SolarLac . Trim as brushed Humbrol . Its flying weight was under 2lbs , 29 ozs comes to mind .

Just started a Luscombe Silvair Kit from same friend . This was intended for FF and Frog 80 power but will now have 2ch radio fitted .

The last Junior 60 I had was a very used second third or fourth hand model when I acquired it and was heavy , brick like heavy ! Covered in Solar Tex and had a clapped out old OS 25 max . It flew beautifully .

I still have a Ben Buckle 54 inch Taylor Craft with a Frog 150 . A decent kit that flies well and have the bigger 74 inch kit for later with a Frog 3.49 RC

ben buckle taylor craft.jpg

Jim Carss27/11/2020 16:26:50
avatar
2170 forum posts
85 photos

Cheer ED

Eros in the above post was built from the original plan at 84" span in 2001 and grossly overpowered with OS48 fs,would fly all day on tick over,open throttle and it reached for the stars,no problems with elevator or rudder controls.

Busy now with a 60" version for SC30 power,making two of them at the same time,one for a friend in Stoke,we have just gone into T3 so hopefully I have enough to keep me occupied

Jim

fly boy327/11/2020 17:12:24
avatar
3804 forum posts
22 photos

Re the Junior 60 being used as a trainer. Years ago a gent in his sixties asked if he could fly on our site during a few days holidays. He turned up with a Junior 60 really looking worst for wear. His flying was good, but his take offs and landings were interesting. Apparently he had taught himself to fly with this model. Model on ground, throttle wide open t/o in a few feet. Landing in to wind was just throttle off, and model would land itself lol. Says a lot for this venerable old model.

Mike Tomlin09/12/2020 09:51:58
4 forum posts

Does anyone have a Ben Buckle plan for the Lanzo Record Breaker? I would like to compare the BB plan with the original 1939 plan, which I think is included with the Belair parts kit.
I was going to buy a kit but would like to see a plan first. BB do not seem to be trading at the moment.
Are there any other large old timers that use a cabane, rather than a pylon, for mounting the wing?

brokenenglish09/12/2020 10:24:17
avatar
624 forum posts
30 photos

I don't think you'll find any significant difference. Ben's plans are always simply the original plan, with minimum RC mods. If an original full-size plan was available, he just photocopied it and, if there was no full size plan, Ben redrew it exactly as per the original.

Also, from memory, I think there are a couple of LRB drawings on Outerzone, including the "Uncle Willie's" plan, which is probably the best drawing.

AFAIK, all the available drawings remain faithful to the original, I don't think anyone has "redesigned" anything.

All Topics | Latest Posts

Please login to post a reply.

Support Our Partners
Subscribe now
Sussex Model Centre
electricwingman 2017
CML
Slec
Sarik
Advertise With Us
Latest "For Sale" Ads
NEW POLL - has the pandemic altered your event safety perceptions?
Q: Has the covid pandemic deterred you from attending shows and events in 2021?

 No, I'll be attending just as many as I usually do
 No, but I'll choose my event with greater care
 Yes, I'll attend fewer events going forward
 Yes, I wont attend any where previously I have

Latest Reviews
Digital Back Issues

RCM&E Digital Back Issues

Contact us

Contact us

Magazine Locator

Want the latest issue of RCM&E? Use our magazine locator link to find your nearest stockist!

Find RCM&E!