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What glues do you use?

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ken anderson.30/06/2020 14:29:06
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8713 forum posts
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poundland 5 min epoxy and cyano,...and pva from wilco's...job's a goodin for my sports models...some still together after years of service......no failure's ...

ken anderson...ne..1...glue dept.

Nigel R30/06/2020 14:51:31
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3987 forum posts
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I mostly use Toolstation or Screwfix for glues. Cheap enough and avoids the absolute bottom of barrel stuff. One exception is thin cyano, the "normal shop" stuff sold as thin is never as thin as thin cyano from a model shop, the last bottle I bought was from Inwoods ebay outlet, own brand stuff, works dandy, thinner than water and soaks right through balsa / liteply / DIY shop ply.

kc30/06/2020 16:04:17
6587 forum posts
173 photos

Nigel & Ken    A Challenge.   would you be willing to test your cheap PVA in a destruction test? A test piece of hardwood or softwood glued,clamped left for 24 hours and then forced apart to see if the wood fibres give way before the glue? Be interesting I think.

I will glue a few softwood testpieces with ResinW, a cheap pva marked 151, another marked Everstone, Westbury Express PVA and Humbrol Extrarez. All same wood, well clamped and left 24 hours. Then I will twist them apart.   

Edited By kc on 30/06/2020 16:11:12

ken anderson.30/06/2020 16:20:57
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ok ...KC,i'll put a couple of bits together now and send/post a pic...leave for 24 hours and see what happens when I pull them to bits...

 

here's one just done...pine and oak+ wilco's glue.....i'll leave clamped until this time tomorrow.... sorry its on its side but you can see what's what..

wilcos pva glue test oak and pine.jpg

 

ken anderson...ne...1...testing dept.

Edited By ken anderson. on 30/06/2020 16:32:52

leccyflyer30/06/2020 17:25:21
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1518 forum posts
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Shows how long ago it was that I last bought Resin W!

ken anderson.01/07/2020 15:13:12
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and the result of my test at ne...1..end after 22.1/2 hours...the two photos are of the joined bits of pine and oak and the other after I tried to part them using a hammer and screwdriver...….pretty good adhesion I would say?...as the pine left some of its self on the oak...

20200701_150216.jpg

20200701_150321.jpg

ken anderson...ne..1..wilco pva dept.

kc01/07/2020 16:35:47
6587 forum posts
173 photos

Thats very good Ken - just as good as Evostik Resin W - in fact it might be the same who knows? Looks like this one at 3 pounds for 125ml.   Not as cheap as Evostik Resin W bought in bigger sizes but a handy size with long spout so a good buy. However all the Wilko brand PVA seems dearer than Evostik Resin W bought at Toolstation except for the 1 litre size which is cheaper. So not much in it for price and just as good it seems.

I am giving my test pieces a little more time to get the full 24 hours before testing.

Edited By kc on 01/07/2020 16:47:35

ken anderson.01/07/2020 16:38:33
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hello KC,the one used is in the first photo..

ken anderson....wilco interior pva dept.

kc01/07/2020 16:48:33
6587 forum posts
173 photos

Just realised it was in your photo and amended my comments.

John Stainforth01/07/2020 19:18:46
367 forum posts
64 photos

Aliphatic resin is my general purpose glue (in place of PVA, which I used to use a long time ago).

CA for speed and tacking balsa sheet down, although I don't actually like it very much - rather unpredictable, except in its ability to glue skin!

I often use both aliphatic resin and CA together, on the different parts of the same assembly. Aliphatic allows me to move things around a bit to get the alignments dead right, then CA to lock the parts in place - instead of pins.

Epoxy for all ply and control surface pinned hinges. I like to use so-called half hour epoxy rather than the five minute stuff. I find the working time of the latter is often too short for me.

Preferred brands are Deluxe and Zpoxy, for the aliphatic resin and epoxy. Poundland for CA, which I find just as good, if not better than the hobby-shop brands - and vastly cheaper.

Have also tried many other glues, such as Superphatic, which seems good, though I'm not yet won over by it.

kc02/07/2020 11:38:06
6587 forum posts
173 photos

The results of my own tests in the challenge. Each glue was used on an identical piece of hardwood and glued to another different piece of good hardwood. Overlap glued was about 40mm sq and clamped for 40 hours. ( longer than 24 to give the cheaper glues a fair chance ) Each piece was given an identical hammer blow which separated the parts.

Results

Evostik Wood Glue ResinW ( an old bottle at least 3 or more years old ) = wood fibres parted about instead of glue line. No sign of glue parting so glue stronger than a good piece of hardwood = very satisfactory.

151 glue = a few traces of the wood fibres parting and some of the glueline parted = a better result than when I tried it before possibly because I left it for 40 hours instead of 24. = not good enough for me to use on planes, but could be OK for DIY use on large areas.

Humbrol Extrarez ( old bottle 3 years old) = wood fibres parted and partial glueline parting = OK for planes where quick drying is needed but not as good as ResinW

Everstone = some fibres parted but mostly the glueline parted= I wouldn't use on planes but only on DIY jobs with large surfaces to be glued.

Westbury Express PVA this glue seemed funny immediately I bought it at a show - may have been frost which separated it a bit so I shook the bottle and it seemed to recover. So as it was 'damaged' I didnt expect good results and used different wood and glued to ply. = the ply veneer parted not the glue line! So OK especially if I need to sand the wood afterwards.

So Resin W gave the best results for me. The Wilko interior glue that Ken used seems as good and it's available in smaller size with long spout so would be an alternative when I run out. Not worth bothering with cheap PVA glues for planes in my view. We use so little and consider the work thats wasted if the fundamental items give way!

kc02/07/2020 11:48:10
6587 forum posts
173 photos

I did further tests on balsa instead of hardwood ( OK balsa is technically a hardwood! )

Resin W the balsa gave way before the glue just as expected.  = just the right glue to use for balsa if you can leave it to dry for 24 hours without moving.

SuperPhatic. 2 bits of balsa were overlapped 15mm sq and clamped together and the very thin glue was 'wicked in' like we do with cyano. = the glue hardly penetrated and there was little strength in the joint which easily failed. = not satisfactory way to use this. If anybody has used it then please tell me the correct technique! Or has my Superphatic gone off in a year?

Edited By kc on 02/07/2020 11:49:43

Nigel R02/07/2020 12:02:20
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I've always been somewhat suspicious of the "wicking in" capabilities of alliphatic. Just me, perhaps, but it looks far too thick. It is only the thinnest of cyano that really seems to work well in that way.

I'm using B&Q branded PVA. It has reasonable consistency. Apologies but have not had time to do any joint testing with it. It cost about £5 for five litres some long while ago. I doubt it is as concentrated as Resin W. However, for balsa, I suspect the slightly consistency may work in its favour, as it would soak into the wood and cause it to expand slightly making joints subtly tighter.

I have some pound shop PVA around the house, it is very different stuff. Much, much thinner, not opaque, almost like skimmed milk. I have never used it in anger on anything other than paper for kids craft stuff, it looks poor by comparison. It is the kind of consistency you would expect for sealing plaster before painting.

mal brewer02/07/2020 12:02:30
319 forum posts
1 photos

I've always used Resin W for all wood to wood joints, including dihedral braces and engine bulkheads and bearers since the old days of balsa cement and I've never had a glue failure.The only place I don't use it is on surface joints,such as joining sheet balsa for wing skinning,or when planking a fuselage, as it doesn't sand very well. the best glue I've found for planking is ..........balsa cement...............Mal

kc02/07/2020 12:06:04
6587 forum posts
173 photos

Nigel i was talking about SuperPhatic which is thin like water.

Bob Cotsford02/07/2020 15:33:48
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8646 forum posts
483 photos

The Superphatic that I've got dries very rubbery, it is a FiveStar branded one and I've no idea if they're all like that. It reminded me of the way Copydex dries, but without the smell. I tried it once but had no confidence in it at all so now it lives at the back of the glue shelf.

Nigel R02/07/2020 16:04:22
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3987 forum posts
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I have deluxe materials stuff. Smells quite odd. I didn't notice much difference in practice to PVA, albeit slightly quicker drying.

Doctor Chinnery02/07/2020 19:42:47
43 forum posts

Excellent practical research - I need to restock my adhesives drawer so Resin W it will be via the Internet - postage is generally cheaper than diesel - and in retirement you have all the time in the world. Until that arrives I still have some R/C modellers glue which has been my go to for general sticking duties since forever ( but will continue with epoxy for firewalls obviously and EvoStik for doublers ). In the past I have used white glue with G/F bandage to join veneered foam wings in smaller planes without any problems, and so will have no hesitation in using Resin W in the same situation as I loath working with epoxy unless I absolutely have to. But - would I be pushing it doing the same with an i/c powered Wot4 wing?

Tosh McCaber02/07/2020 20:29:22
128 forum posts
23 photos

FWIW:

Titebond 111 Ultimate aliphatic, for most areas that I used to use PVA- used it for 20-30 years with absolutely no problems. Absolute strength, and dries hard compared with any of the PVAs- easy to sand.

I've recently being using No Nonsence CA glue from Screwfix/ B&Q, (Howdens is very similar) with the accellerator on one surface, glue on the other, more or less instant- very strong- bond. The glue is medium viscosity. I've also used Pondlands CAs- very thin and a very good bond on most surfaces.

Doc Marten02/07/2020 21:05:05
636 forum posts
7 photos

Not seen anyone mention the merits of Gorilla white, never tested a joint but i've no reason to believe it's inferior in any way to Resin W, it sands very well too which is a bonus.

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