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Flaps. Servo speed.

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Richard Clark 212/07/2020 07:25:16
424 forum posts
Posted by Keith Miles 2 on 11/07/2020 21:35:58:
Posted by Richard Clark 2 on 11/07/2020 18:47:03:

Perhaps surprisingly I've never flown any Cessna, nor been a passenger in one.

As for the flap to elevator compensation moving the elevator fast when the full amount of the 'slow' flap part has not yet arrived at the mixer so is not yet 'known' by it I don't see how that can happen.

Did I say that or are you quoting someone else? Sorry if I misunderstood.

In my case, I have yet to use a mix, so can’t comment on that at all. First impressions suggested that I might not need it. A club mate has a Hangar 9 Cirrus and I asked him for advice on this issue before I test flew my Super Chipmunk. He doesn’t use a mix either.

 

It was somebody else, sorry  not to be as clear as I should have been. (To me what he said seems impossible.)

I tend to use a flap to elevator mix (if needed, which it often isn't) because I've got a 'thing' about never using the trims. It comes from my liking for 'mechanically optimising' the model rather than adjusting throws, centres, etc. electronically. During the first few flights of a new model I land and 'mechanically adjust' several times and from then on the trims remains  centralised and never touched.

Edited By Richard Clark 2 on 12/07/2020 07:26:34

Edited By Richard Clark 2 on 12/07/2020 07:34:58

Frank Skilbeck12/07/2020 07:41:35
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Posted by Richard Clark 2 on 11/07/2020 18:47:03:

As for the flap to elevator compensation moving the elevator fast when the full amount of the 'slow' flap part has not yet arrived at the mixer so is not yet 'known' by it I don't see how that can happen.

Depends how you have done the servo slow, quite a while back on a model I had I'd used an external servo slow/reverser (two flaps on one channel) so the mix went at full speed but not the flaps. Agreed radios I have with built in slow, apply this too any mix too.

Frank Skilbeck12/07/2020 07:46:00
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Posted by Richard Clark 2 on 12/07/2020 07:25:16:

I tend to use a flap to elevator mix (if needed, which it often isn't) because I've got a 'thing' about never using the trims. It comes from my liking for 'mechanically optimising' the model rather than adjusting throws, centres, etc. electronically. During the first few flights of a new model I land and 'mechanically adjust' several times and from then on the trims remains centralised and never touched.

Edited By Richard Clark 2 on 12/07/2020 07:26:34

Edited By Richard Clark 2 on 12/07/2020 07:34:58

Bit difficult on some gliders which use the flaps and ailerons for camber changes and need different elevator positions for speed and thermal settings, but that's getting away from the topic of this thread.

Ron Gray12/07/2020 07:48:29
2235 forum posts
978 photos

Slow down, fast up - can get you out of a sticky situation!

Martin Harris12/07/2020 16:41:04
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9411 forum posts
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...or put you in one! Certain setups can result in rapid sink if the flaps are put away too quickly! Fine at 100 feet but at 10?

Frank, if you have a transmitter capable of setting flight modes with independant trims then it's very easy to cater for multiple flap situations.  This is certainly the case with Jeti but I suspect FRSky, Multiplex and higher end versions of the main brands will also support similar functionality.

Edited By Martin Harris on 12/07/2020 16:45:15

Richard Clark 212/07/2020 19:05:55
424 forum posts
Posted by Frank Skilbeck on 12/07/2020 07:46:00:
Posted by Richard Clark 2 on 12/07/2020 07:25:16:
 

I tend to use a flap to elevator mix (if needed, which it often isn't) because I've got a 'thing' about never using the trims. It comes from my liking for 'mechanically optimising' the model rather than adjusting throws, centres, etc. electronically. During the first few flights of a new model I land and 'mechanically adjust' several times and from then on the trims remains centralised and never touched.

Edited By Richard Clark 2 on 12/07/2020 07:26:34

Edited By Richard Clark 2 on 12/07/2020 07:34:58

Bit difficult on some gliders which use the flaps and ailerons for camber changes and need different elevator positions for speed and thermal settings, but that's getting away from the topic of this thread.

I've only got one (powered) glider and I do it with flight modes, as Martin says in his post immediately above this one. You can of course achieve the same result either way (or even do both on the same model ).

It may be strictly 'off topic' but the OP has said he may come back  with  more questions,  but if he sees all this stuff he may not need to.

Edited By Richard Clark 2 on 12/07/2020 19:14:47

Edited By Richard Clark 2 on 12/07/2020 19:16:05

Frank Skilbeck12/07/2020 19:54:17
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4752 forum posts
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Posted by Martin Harris on 12/07/2020 16:41:04:

Frank, if you have a transmitter capable of setting flight modes with independant trims then it's very easy to cater for multiple flap situations. This is certainly the case with Jeti but I suspect FRSky, Multiplex and higher end versions of the main brands will also support similar functionality.

Edited By Martin Harris on 12/07/2020 16:45:15

Yep, Multiplex have had this feature ever since digital trims were introduced on the Royal Evo over 15 years ago.

john stones 112/07/2020 21:19:58
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Yep, I have a question, anyone see where my exhaust landed ?

Tony Richardson12/07/2020 22:59:09
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I have flaps set up on a switch for take off and a slider for landing, the switch can be set at two preset positions for take off with down flap ay normal speed raising the flaps is a little slower allowing me in my advanced years to keep up with the aircraft should it decide to misbehave itself, the slider allows me to lower flaps to the degree I am comfortable with in the prevailing conditions, I also mix in elevator to follow flaps if required - depends on model - both at a slower speed so again easy to keep up with. It's all personal preference I think, as usual many different ways to achieve the same end.

Richard Clark 213/07/2020 00:02:47
424 forum posts
Posted by Tony Richardson on 12/07/2020 22:59:09:

I have flaps set up on a switch for take off and a slider for landing, the switch can be set at two preset positions for take off with down flap ay normal speed raising the flaps is a little slower allowing me in my advanced years to keep up with the aircraft should it decide to misbehave itself, the slider allows me to lower flaps to the degree I am comfortable with in the prevailing conditions, I also mix in elevator to follow flaps if required - depends on model - both at a slower speed so again easy to keep up with. It's all personal preference I think, as usual many different ways to achieve the same end.

Yes. If you mix flap into elevator the 'flap' part of the overall elevator movement will move at the same speed at which the flap is moving which is what you want. Elevator movement caused by the stick is nor affected by this, which is also what you want.

As for sliders or switches, it a matter of personal opinion,, as you say. When I first used flaps it was both intuitive and 'obvious' to use a slider so that is what I did. Later I found three positions, off, takeoff (half) and landing (full) was all that is needed You can of course use the tekeoff position for landing if you want. I bet hardly anyone using a slider ever uses anything except the two ends and the usually 'indented' middle.

Strictly, glider camber adjustment is not the same thing as flaps.

Tony Richardson13/07/2020 00:28:23
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645 forum posts
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RC 2, I put the flaps on a switch for take off for the simple reason i did not want down elevator on take off, i guess i could have faffed around with mixes and switches but for my 72 year old gray matter this was the least trying solution laughlaugh and i would rather be flying than messing around with a "confuser" radio......

Richard Clark 213/07/2020 00:29:41
424 forum posts
Posted by Frank Skilbeck on 12/07/2020 19:54:17:
Yep, Multiplex have had this feature ever since digital trims were introduced on the Royal Evo over 15 years ago.

Multiplex was first with most things.

FM, PCM. computer radio, synthesised 'spot' frequencies so no crystals needed, a built in scanner so no 35 MHz 'spot' checks needed, the terrific 'intelligent' IPD 35 MHz receivers, and 2,4 telemetry, which they had from day one. Also their OS was the 'inspiration' for OpenTx.

I've used Multiplex continuously since the early 1970s, when Crescent, who also made the original Tornado and Bullet kits, was the UK importer.

But I'm not impressed by the new Cockpit.

Robert Welford13/07/2020 09:14:39
205 forum posts
4 photos
Posted by Richard Clark 2 on 13/07/2020 00:29:41:

But I'm not impressed by the new Cockpit.

Richard: what are your concerns with the new Cockpit SX 7/9/12?

I own a SX9 tx, but have yet to use in anger as I have few other Mpx transmitters in use.

Richard Clark 213/07/2020 11:13:03
424 forum posts
Posted by Robert Welford on 13/07/2020 09:14:39:
Posted by Richard Clark 2 on 13/07/2020 00:29:41:
 

But I'm not impressed by the new Cockpit.

Richard: what are your concerns with the new Cockpit SX 7/9/12?

I own a SX9 tx, but have yet to use in anger as I have few other Mpx transmitters in use.

If I didn't have an Evo, nothing. Except maybe those 'roller' controls placed at the back so you can't see how they are set. Particularly so as they 'roll' further than the width of the slots they are in.

But having both an Evo and a Royal SX (which are basically the same) and having carefully read the manual for all versions of the new Cockpit SX I find it has far less functionality than those.

Edited By Richard Clark 2 on 13/07/2020 11:17:53

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