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Seagull Boomerang or Arising Star - any difference at all?

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Jonathan M14/07/2020 17:42:39
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747 forum posts
294 photos

Looking to buy a traditional trainer for club use with a buddy-box, and have a spare OS46 to go into it.

Is there any practical difference between the Boomerang and the Arising Star (2" bigger span), or are they in effect exactly the same thing? Are they equally robust? Different wing section? Any real difference at all?

Boomerang:

Span – 61ins
Area – 612 sq.ins
Suits – 40-46 2-stroke
Approx flying weight – 5.7-6.1lb
Section – Semi-symmetrical

Arising Star:

Approx flying weight - 5-6lb
Suits - 40-46 2-stroke
Area - 645 sq.ins
Span - 63ins

Alternatively, anything else that is still made that'll fit the bill?

Concorde Speedbird14/07/2020 17:48:57
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I believe the wing section is a Clark Y on the Arising star, whereas like you have mentioned it is semi symmetrical on the Boomerang
Buy Seagull Arising Star 40-46 Trainer 1600mm ARF from HobbyGulf ...

cymaz14/07/2020 18:05:23
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9277 forum posts
1200 photos

Buy the cheapest and enjoy. They are both good cheap trainers.

Jonathan M14/07/2020 18:30:27
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747 forum posts
294 photos

Cheers.

Just to say its not for me to learn on, but to use with the buddy-lead to introduce potential new fliers and to train beginners etc.

Our club field is exposed, usually with a bit of slope lift/sink on two of the four sides and can be a bit turbulent due to trees upwind - so the usual modern lightweight foam trainers don't really help novices gain early stick-time or confidence.

Richard Wills 214/07/2020 18:47:03
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If it is usually breezy/turbulent the Boomerang would be the better choice.

David Davis14/07/2020 19:04:29
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The Boomerang is my favourite ARTF trainer. It can be flown in a stiff breeze without ballooning when turning into wind. There are lots of beginners in my club and I do a fair bit of instructing. I've just maidened a Boomerang this afternoon. It was powered by an old Webra 40 fitted with an MDS silencer. It was alright but I think I'll fit my Enya 50. I've flown that combination in the past very successfully. Which engine will you be using?

Jonathan M14/07/2020 20:22:18
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747 forum posts
294 photos

Thanks for the steer, especially the point about the Boomerang being the better option in breezy conditions.

DD, I've got a used OS Max 46FX and I was going to buy a new trainer for it - hence my question earlier - but I've just now been gifted by another member for club use a very knackered-looking Boomerang MkII complete with an Irvine 40 !!

It is restorable as a winter job, but frankly its potentially quicker (and less irritating hassle than trying to do a never-ending series of quick fixes) to put together a new one for the rest of this summer, and install whichever of the two engines runs the most reliably and is better suited for the purpose.

Boomerang.jpg

Steve J14/07/2020 20:28:29
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Posted by David Davis on 14/07/2020 19:04:29:

It can be flown in a stiff breeze without ballooning when turning into wind. ...

I do a fair bit of instructing. ...

How does the model know when it is 'turning into wind' ?

Richard Clark 215/07/2020 07:01:02
416 forum posts
Posted by Steve J on 14/07/2020 20:28:29:

..

How does the model know when it is 'turning into wind' ?

EarlyBird15/07/2020 07:46:37
186 forum posts
146 photos

How does the model know when it is 'turning into wind' ?

Well that is any easy question!

Obviously IT knows, because IT has Ballooned up. But that is only after starting the turn. How it knows before is beyond me.

smileysmileywinkwink 2

Jonathan M15/07/2020 08:52:31
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747 forum posts
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Never mind what the model knows or otherwise, what will two almost identical trainer models with moderate dihedral do differently as they are turned into the wind, everything else being equal? Will the one with a flat-bottomed wing section balloon up more than the one with the semi-symmetrical wing section?

Steve J15/07/2020 09:02:31
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1976 forum posts
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Posted by Jonathan M on 15/07/2020 08:52:31:

Never mind what the model knows or otherwise, what will two almost identical trainer models with moderate dihedral do differently as they are turned into the wind, everything else being equal?

Assuming that the model is high enough that wind gradient effect are negligible, the model doesn't know if it is being turned into or out of wind. 'ballooning' is down to the actions or perceptions of person on the sticks.

Denis Watkins15/07/2020 09:08:37
4528 forum posts
122 photos

The flat bottomed wing will gain height more readily into wind

Where the semi symmetrical wing will penetrate more easily without gaining height from the wind

Big advantage with landing, the flat bottomed wing

Can be flown more slowly for arrival

But in the UK, I think the Boomerang can be flown on more days considering wind speeds

David Davis15/07/2020 09:13:12
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3782 forum posts
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Posted by Steve J on 15/07/2020 09:02:31:
Posted by Jonathan M on 15/07/2020 08:52:31:

Never mind what the model knows or otherwise, what will two almost identical trainer models with moderate dihedral do differently as they are turned into the wind, everything else being equal?

Assuming that the model is high enough that wind gradient effect are negligible, the model doesn't know if it is being turned into or out of wind. 'ballooning' is down to the actions or perceptions of person on the sticks.

That may well be the case, I bow to the greater aeronautical knowlege of those who state that there is no such thing as ballooning into wind. However, to my way of thinking if a model is travelling downwind and then turns into wind the lift should increase if the model has a Clark Y aerofoil because the airspeed over the wing has increased. I.e models' speed plus speed of the wind produces more lift, that's why we take off into wind isn't it?  If it's all in my imagination I'm happy to live with that.

The Boomerang still remains my favourite ARTF trainer espaeciallly if the weather's a bit breezy. Telemaster 40s are nice flyers too but you have to build those and they DO have flat bottomed wing sections!

Edited By David Davis on 15/07/2020 09:14:46

Edited By David Davis on 15/07/2020 09:17:07

Jonathan M15/07/2020 09:29:16
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747 forum posts
294 photos

Irvine 40 or OS 46...?

Denis Watkins15/07/2020 09:34:53
4528 forum posts
122 photos

46 on the Boomerang

john stones 115/07/2020 10:36:48
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11592 forum posts
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Dunno if there's a touch more incidence on a Rising Star, do know that they balloon into wind, as it's a trainer and the pilot is learning, it adds to the workload putting them off when It's blowy, Boomerang for me.

Doctor Chinnery15/07/2020 10:41:21
41 forum posts

We all know that any airframe is unaware of it's ground speed whether it is flying downwind or into the wind, however subjectively some of my planes appear to want to zoom as they turn into the wind and some are blissfully unaware of their ground speed when turning back into the wind. Having learned to fly models on the slope I was taught to push in a brief touch of down to offset my Impala's tendency to zoom a little when straightening up out of a turn, my electric Junior 60 for example, does exactly this (both sport flat bottomed airfoils), yet almost anything I've flown with a symmetrical/semi-symmetrical airfoil ( seem ! ) not to  🤔 .

Edited By Mr Chinnery on 15/07/2020 10:43:08

EarlyBird15/07/2020 10:46:55
186 forum posts
146 photos

Boomerang for me, as I have seen novices fly them in 20mph + winds.

Ian Jones15/07/2020 12:29:55
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I've trained newbies on both and also the Irvine Tutor 40 (I & II). By far the best was the Tutor 40 but a very, very close 2nd was the Boomerang. Tutor 40 is no longer available so it's the Boomerang, which incidently I used for my B test.

With the CG set correctly (that is, not nose heavy) it has a plenty long enough glide for landing and as has already been stated is better suited to windy conditions.

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