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Ben Buckle Super 60

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Barry W26/01/2010 09:49:56
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I have a question for Timbo or some other specialist.
 
I am building a BB Super 60 4 Channel. I am now at the stage where I need to buy an engine. the Super 60 is specified for somthing like a 2 stroke OS35AX.
However I am thinking it may be worthwhile trying an electric outrunner motor.
I believe the model, which has a 64 inch span, will weight in the region of 4 to 5 lbs but there is no weight specified with the instructions.
 
The questions I have are thefollowing.
 
1) Would an E-Flight Power 32 650 watt motor be sufficient or will I require an E-Flight power 46 of 800 Watts?
 
2) What would be the recommended LIPO battery size either a 3S or 4S and how many milliamps capacity?  I would like to be able to get a flight time of say at least 10 minutes with some very gentle aerobatics
.
3) What would be the recommended prop size for the motor on this slow flying type airplane.
 
I would just like to say how useful and friendly I have found this forum. I am starting  model flying after several year layoff and things have moved on quite a bit since the 1980s. I live in France and you are quite lucky in the UK, in spite of your weather. Here we don't have a similar forum to this one neither the model shops that you have in the UK with such a diversity of products.
 
Barry 
Tim Mackey26/01/2010 10:30:40
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Hi Barry. The smaller of those motors will be fine on a slow old timer like that, and use a low cell count like 3s, with a nice large 14" prop or so. I would expect you will pull around 30 -35A maiximum, so go for something like a 50A ESC.
TBH I might even consider a lower Kv motor of amybe 500 -600, and swing an even bigger prop, more slowly - this gives you better efficiency too. For a nice long flight time, get something like a 3000 mahr pack or more. Once she is up an away, you find yourself on half throttle or less for most of the flight I suspect, so this will give you loads of flight time.


Edited By Timbo - Administrator on 26/01/2010 10:36:17

Tim Mackey26/01/2010 10:45:05
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This type of motor I reckon would suit that model just fine, with a nice big prop of about 14"
I wouldnt aim for more than about 350 Watts to be honest, - these old timers are fine on about 60 - 75 watts per pound or even less.
This particualr version might be better suited to 4s but then the current will be lower ( for the same wattage ) so you could use a lower capacity 4s battery.
Have you got a wattmeter Barry?
Incidentally, if you would prefer to stick to a smaller prop ( 12" or so ) then you would need to revert back to a slightly higher Kv motor of around 1000 or so, and then use the 3s battery. I know the choices may seem a bit bewildering, but look at it as versatility, rather complication. Knowing what space you have available for batteries, and AUW, COG position, the size and RPM of the prop that you like etc all mean you can then choose the right motor to suit those parameters.
Good luck, and keep us informed of progress - once you get it right, you will love the clean and quiet smooth power of a leccy model, and there will be one more of us, and one less of them LOL

Edited By Timbo - Administrator on 26/01/2010 10:53:38

Barry W26/01/2010 11:22:38
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Many thanks Timbo for your prompt and detailed reply. I will buy the motor and prop you recommend and will keep you posted on the way it works out.
It is interesting this electrical business and a great learning experience.
Be prepared I may be asking some more questions later on.
 
Cheers
 
Barry
 
Pete B - Moderator26/01/2010 11:30:16
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Hi Barry,
 
I too live in France and I have to agree that model shops are few and far between! I buy most of my kit via the internet, either stocking up when I'm in the UK or mail order to France. There are some good companies here whose postal rates are quite reasonable.
 
I agree with Timbo that the 32 motor will be plenty. However, they are unfortunately rather expensive and there are many cheaper motor of a similar power to be found. I fly an E-Flite Beaver, 68", weighing 5lb 2oz, powered by a Turnigy 42-50 700Kv, which has been more than adequate. I use a 4S 3000mah LoongMax which gives me 10 minutes of easy flying. I had to prop down to a 12 x 6 to get down to 489 watts output, which is near enough 100W/lb - more than enough for such a model! Some info re this motor in my Beaver thread here.
 
On the other hand, I have a Phoenix Rainbow, 63", weighing 4lb, which flies very nicely on a Wasp C3536 1100Kv, with a 3S 2200mah Li-Po, again with up to 10 mins duration. BRC do a similar spec motor here.
 
I've no experience of the Super 60 but such a classic kit will have been designed to withstand the rigours of IC so you'll probably need the more powerful motor, but don't rule out going a bit lighter if you can.
 
Good luck with it,
 
Pete
 
 
 
 
 
Tim Mackey26/01/2010 11:37:19
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Posted by Barry W on 26/01/2010 11:22:38:
Many thanks Timbo for your prompt and detailed reply. I will buy the motor and prop you recommend and will keep you posted on the way it works out.
It is interesting this electrical business and a great learning experience.
Be prepared I may be asking some more questions later on.
 
Cheers
 
Barry
 
 
Which one LOL
If you go for the GC one, then you need to decide on the battery you will be using. If you go for a real big prop 14"+   then you may well find a 3s is OK, but for smaller prop, you would likely need a 4s. Perhaps to be on the safe side, use a 4s pack, and get a couple or so different props, then you can see which gives the best overall result - remember the wattmeter suggestion too
Barry W26/01/2010 16:44:17
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Many thanks both Timbo and Peter for your advice. Don't say I didn't warn you about me asking questions!
Have you any particular recommendation concerning the make of Watt meter. I can see it will be useful in seeing what is gong on with the battery and ESC.
Since my unexpected success in converting the Gentle Lady to electric I am all charged up (sic) on this electric business. In fact just today I had two splendid flights with the GL one lasting 22 minutes as it has been a sunny day with some thermal activity down here. 
 
Barry
Tim Mackey26/01/2010 16:54:21
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20920 forum posts
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Either the Hyperion, or the Astro Flight are reputed to be the more accurate amongst the many that are out there.
PS...any more rubbing it in about how nice and sunny the weather is, and I will have to remove your account

Edited By Timbo - Administrator on 26/01/2010 16:55:42

Stephen Grigg26/01/2010 19:07:03
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8691 forum posts
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There is nothing like an old floaty with a little 4 stroke pottering about the sky
Wilco Wingco13/08/2014 18:58:34
223 forum posts
3 photos

Just got an airframe off e-bay for a give away price but now I need to know

what the throws are for this 4 channel model. Also the cofg and tank position.

Cheers.

Mike.

PatMc13/08/2014 20:13:12
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4326 forum posts
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If you do a search on Outerzone for Super 60 it will come up with two downloadable plans. Both give the cg & throws for elevator & rudder. There's also optional ailerons shown on one but no throws given for them.

Edited By PatMc on 13/08/2014 20:13:42

Wilco Wingco13/08/2014 22:23:29
223 forum posts
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Thanks PatMc for the quick responce. I can now do the initial set up. Will have to play the ailerons by ear unless someon else knows what they should be.

David Davis14/08/2014 07:03:21
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3600 forum posts
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My Super 60s have inset ailerons and balance on or just behind the main spar. I've never flown a Super 60 with strip ailerons but I doubt that aileron movement is that critical on any Super 60 especially if you are an experienced pilot. If you're concerned at all you could introduce differential and use rates and exponential to smooth things out.

penn models super sixty (3).jpg

super 60 squadron 3.jpg

Edited By David Davis on 14/08/2014 07:10:03

Wilco Wingco14/08/2014 10:09:49
223 forum posts
3 photos

Thanks for the comment David. That's just what I was going to do, like you said nothing seems to be too critical on this model.

gangster28/08/2014 14:58:14
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Barry. Unless I have missed it nothing has been mentioned with regards battery position and CofG. Having been very successful with electrifying a Junior 60 I then went onto building the low wing super60 and have discovered that it's way too nose heavy with a 3s or a 4s in front of the leading edge I have had to settle for making a battery box behind the leading edge and will have to put up with removing the wings to change the battery. At least it balances

without lead it is yet to fly but a friend has a high wing one with battery under the wing Emax 2820 07 4s pack and it has more than enough chuff. Flys perfectly

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