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Engine for Flair Fokker DVII

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Stevo30/11/2011 14:19:08
2699 forum posts
419 photos
Hello !
I have a fokker DVII (Flair!) on the go, and have a spare Saito 50 (almost new, bags of compression) to go into it.
I dont want blistering performance, just somethingto take off, poodle around and land. The aircraft is being built light, no overhead of lozenge paint (although I have the lozenge 'tex). I think I will be Ok with this, but Ive seen several others content with s Saito 82 in there ...
Danny Fenton30/11/2011 15:17:46
9726 forum posts
4547 photos
Hi Steve, good to see you, I must have missed you join us.
Sorry I can't help with the motor size stuff, now if it was electric I may have been able to make some suggestions

Martin Harris30/11/2011 15:21:58
9505 forum posts
256 photos
Flair advise from a 48 upwards so you're in the "scale" end of the've got loads of wing area so as long as you don't want to *prop hang you should be OK
*I'm told the full size used to use a prop hang method to attack other aircraft I suspect it was more related to its benign recovery characteristics than any sustained prop hanging ability
Braddock, VC30/11/2011 15:39:17
1657 forum posts
82 photos
Interestingly Dudley Pattison, the designer, used a laser 50 in his prototype so the saito could well be on the money. I used a laser 80 in mine, but had no need for nose weight at all. You'll probably need quite a bit of lead up front in yours.
The laser 80 was a bit too much, as the plane could knife-edge up and down the strip and even outdo the full size in the prop hanging dept, but required almost full throttle to pull the stunt with a 14x6 wooden airscrew up front.
Sadly it's laid up following a mid air with planet earth.
Simon Chaddock30/11/2011 18:05:59
5777 forum posts
3055 photos
From what I can gather the DVII, like the Triplane before it, could achieve (& maintain) a much higher angle of attack with its relatively thick aerofoil with a well rounded leading edge than the thin under cambered sections favoured by the allies hence its famed 'prop hanging' ability.
So not what is called prop hanging today but it certainly caught out many an allied reconnaissance or bomber pilot.
andy watson30/11/2011 22:54:31
1942 forum posts
20 photos
Mine flys beautifully on an OS70 FS.
Needed a big lump of lead though.
Engine Doctor01/12/2011 13:15:44
2595 forum posts
40 photos
Hello Steve . I use a Saito 50 in my teaching trainer and its not overly powerful. I also recently sold my Fokker Dv11 to a freind . That originally had an ASP 80 FS in it and had more power than neede so it was changed for an old laser 70 that flew it very well . So the Saito may be all right for a calm day but a little extra power available IMHO wouldnt go didn't say if the Saito was an Old version or the newer hi-lift cam job as this does make a lot of difference to power .
Stevo01/12/2011 14:10:22
2699 forum posts
419 photos
Well thanks indeed for all your replies!
Looks like the Saito 50 my be a little on the edge, but funds dictate that I cant get another engine. I only ever fly on calm days anyway so hopefully not a problem.
The engine I have is a yet-to-be-run-in Saito 50, hemispherical head design.
Braddock, VC01/12/2011 14:34:13
1657 forum posts
82 photos
Don't be seduced by the thought of extra power, use the saito. If it's marginal then up the nitro, if the power is marginal calm days are the worst, a 10 mph breeze is an airspeed of 10 mph when the plane is sitting still, afterall
I've seen one fly well on an OS 52 surpass 4stroke and the saito is probably more powerful than that.
Use a large diameter low pitch prop, 13x5 or 14x4 if you can get one, you'll be surprised at how well it performs. I got my 14x4 from jim davis models in 1983 and treasured it ever since it sits on front of a southerner major 84" wings driven by an OS 52 surpass and it will pull that very steeply upward on 10% nitro.
Stevo01/12/2011 15:45:12
2699 forum posts
419 photos
Cheers John, I had the same in my ill-fated Flair Cub (Little over weight with sprung oleos, pilot, d-day stripes and american insignia.. rib tapes) and it looped it no problem.
I'm impressed with the no. of replies on here !
Will look for that elusive big fine prop, I have the same engine in a PUP, not yet covered, with full push-pull for rudder and elevator (twin servos)... but with cold weather coming in, workshop time is severely limited... Brrrrr......
Djay04/12/2011 09:24:42
543 forum posts
445 photos
Mine has an ASP 70 fs in it and it is the perfect match for this airframe.
Cheap to buy as well from Just engines.
Now on its 8th year of service and still flying regularly.
Engine Doctor04/12/2011 11:36:13
2595 forum posts
40 photos
Posted by John Gibbs on 01/12/2011 14:34:13:
. If it's marginal then up the nitro, if the power is marginal calm days are the worst, a 10 mph breeze is an airspeed of 10 mph when the plane is sitting still, afterall
John 10 mph is a really calm day at our field .
The secret of flight is to aim at the ground ------------------and miss !

Edited By Engine Doctor on 04/12/2011 11:39:04

andy watson04/12/2011 13:58:22
1942 forum posts
20 photos
The problem with going for the smaller engine is this means even more lead.
I'm not saying it is really a problem- Flair models are as reknown for flying really well as they are for the incredible amounts of church roof secreted about their person!
It just seems to me you might as well have that weight do something. They do seem to go well on very modest sized engines though- and since the 50 is just sat there, then you might as well give it a bash.

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