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Martins i/c Mustang

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Martin McIntosh06/11/2013 23:26:14
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3420 forum posts
1213 photos

Again a lot of work done but not much to show for it. On testing the legs it was found that the mounting bearers need to be angled backwards quite a lot (the opposite to a Spit for example).This entailed a fair bit of Dremel work and packing in order to get them to sit level in the wells whilst maintaining a straight track. You would be well advised to take a close look at the angles of these before cutting the slots in the ribs.

Decided to change the door servos to Vigor MG. Luckily it was possible to reverse one of these without reverting to more electronics. A single `Landtastic` home made servo slow makes the sequence look realistic although I have yet to fit the linkages. The actual doors, made from alloy, are next but it puzzles me as to why they do not cover the complete wheel wells. Difficult to find a pic of the underside of a full size with the doors closed.

Danny Fenton06/11/2013 23:46:32
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9627 forum posts
4449 photos

Hi Martin, I have a rather extensive library on the Mustang, this is a shot from the Hendon Museum Does it help?

2011-10-14_153135_m_dsc_0160.jpg

2011-10-14_153158_m_dsc_0179.jpg

I threw in the second shot as its for an area I had to work hard to get details of. Its the Oil radiator flap. The larger more common water radiator flap is further rearward wink 2

Cheer

Danny

Edited By Danny Fenton on 06/11/2013 23:48:15

Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator06/11/2013 23:49:51
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15748 forum posts
1460 photos

Tricky business retract U/C's. Looks like we've been spending tonight doing similar things Martin - you fettling the angles and me sorting cutouts! Its worth it in the end though - I mean you really can't have a P51, or any WWII standard fighter with the wheels dangling down!

This any use to you?

p-51-mustang-gunfighter.jpg

BEB

TinPot Pilot06/11/2013 23:57:40
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155 forum posts

Martin, does this help?

Martin McIntosh07/11/2013 18:43:41
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3420 forum posts
1213 photos

Thanks for the pics, they show them as I would have thought they should be. All the ones I have looked at are of small doors which the plan seems to mimic. Glad that I did not cut them out last night.

Thinking about the angle of the bearers towards the upper surface, this was possibly done to give a retraction angle nearer to 85deg. but was not possible with the larger units I have chosen although there would be little difference at the end of the day. I am happy with the way that they have turned out so far.

BEB - has anyone had chance to look at the `posting text after a pic` problem yet?

Martin Mc.

Martin McIntosh07/11/2013 19:30:44
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3420 forum posts
1213 photos

A pic of a full size and one of the plan to show what I mean.

martins ic mustang 067.jpg

Martin McIntosh07/11/2013 19:31:44
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3420 forum posts
1213 photos

martins ic mustang 068.jpg

Martin McIntosh07/11/2013 19:32:57
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3420 forum posts
1213 photos

The site has gone really silly now and will only allow one pic at a time.

Martin McIntosh07/11/2013 22:45:23
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3420 forum posts
1213 photos

martins ic mustang 069.jpg

Martin McIntosh07/11/2013 22:54:20
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3420 forum posts
1213 photos

Really confused now. In the above pic the red lines I have drawn would seem to be correct but the pic of the underside would suggest that the dotted line is the join of the main and inner door. Either way these do not agree with the other pic of the main door with the legs extended. Any ideas? Maybe these are different Mks of the aeroplane.

Danny Fenton07/11/2013 23:23:02
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9627 forum posts
4449 photos

Hi Martin, is it possible you are not taking into account that the doors shorten considerably when retracted due to the way the doors are attached to the oleos?

44-63807_71_cf1.jpg

44-63807_19_cf1.jpg

Cheers

Danny

Edited By Danny Fenton on 07/11/2013 23:23:40

Martin McIntosh08/11/2013 00:04:33
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3420 forum posts
1213 photos

Ah, all is clear now. A bit beyond my building skills to do that. My models are `stand as far away as you can get` so I shall have to compromise to make it look right on the ground at least.

Thanks again Danny.

Danny Fenton08/11/2013 00:20:01
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9627 forum posts
4449 photos

Nonsense Martin you are more than capable, mind you I admire you for being able to step away from that level of detail crook wish I could sometimes. I have those very doors to do on my Mustang when I get back to it........

That website by the way MustangsMustangs is an awesome reference site wink 2

Cheers

Danny

Codename-John08/11/2013 00:53:54
1087 forum posts
18 photos

This site is also excellent for 3 view drawings etc, and his model is equisite

Colin Leighfield08/11/2013 06:05:08
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5996 forum posts
2503 photos

When I looked at the Spiteful/ Seafang I found the same thing. The door isn't attached rigidly to the leg, it's hinged to the wing with an articulated connection to the leg. Because the leg and the door rotate on different centres, in the closed position the door is effectively shortened by the distance between the pintle/hinge positions. I think I exchanged with Danny on the idea of attaching the door to the wing instead of the leg on a potential larger model and he advised against it from experience (it was you Danny)?

Danny Fenton08/11/2013 09:00:40
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9627 forum posts
4449 photos

Hi Colin, yes it was me I think. What we discussed was hinging the undercarriage door along the length of the oleo leg not against the wing. hinged on the wing skin should work if rigid enough wink 2

I have a YT Hurricane, and there has been no thought given to the pintle angle when this was designed. This really presses my OCD button and I tried lots of ways to make the door pivot about the leg axis. This was in an attempt to get the door to lie flush when retracted and parallel to the wheel when lowered. I made all sorts of prototypes, most resulted in massive flutter during flight and came off! Anyway the bottom line was (for me), build the correct pintle angle in the first place......

Cheers

Danny

Colin Leighfield08/11/2013 14:13:47
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5996 forum posts
2503 photos

Hi Danny. If that was how you interpreted what I asked, I clearly did a lousy job of trying to explain what I meant. (Nothing new there then)! My interest was in the practicality of hinging the door cover to the wing skin and attaching it by some flexible means to the oleo leg. It was the only way I could see of replicating the u/c on the Spiteful and it looks the same on the Mustang.

I suppose on a smaller scale model it's not worth the hassle, but perhaps on a 1/7 or 1/6 plus model, it could be worth having a bash. It would mean that when landings are a bit ropey (mine) and the oleo gets bent back, there would need to be some give in the attachment to the oleo to avoid breaking the hinge, in addition to the articulation needed to deal with the shortening issue caused by the dissimilar centres of rotation we referred to before.

It looks as if Martin is going to compromise on this one, can't blame him and I doubt if anybody will comment because it's generally what we do anyway. Still got me thinking though.

Danny Fenton08/11/2013 14:21:44
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9627 forum posts
4449 photos

Hi Colin, I wouldn't be too hard on yourself it is just as likely to be me not reading the question properly, I am often doing that crook

I think hinging on the wing skin, or a rib perhaps should be fine. I have seen a pair of ball joins used, one either side of the oleo. This video shows how it should be done wink 2

Cheers
Danny
Colin Leighfield08/11/2013 15:12:34
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5996 forum posts
2503 photos

Thanks Danny. I like the look of that and clearly it's close to scale anyway, so even better.

Martin McIntosh08/11/2013 15:37:13
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3420 forum posts
1213 photos

You have me thinking about this now, and I thought that it would be just the inner doors and sequencer which would give problems! The ones in the video are awesome.

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